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DA:A -- Why it is a poor product and step down from Origins


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#51
Jawson

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casedawgz wrote...

Most 60 dollar games are lucky to give you eight hours, and I frequently drop 10 bucks on two hour movies.


Well if you're talking generic console crap games, maybe.  But that's why I do my research.  If you would gladly spend $60 on an 8 hour game, I have a bridge in Queens to sell you.  <_< I guess that's kind of my point, our expectations should be high for a $40 expansion, otherwise wer'e a bunch of DOPES that would buy any POS that Bioware stamps their name on.  They won't make them better as long as the sheep keep flocking to them, and if you're standards are that low, I guess this point is moot.

#52
Efesell

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Well people can keep unrealistic expectations if they really want.

Myself, I'll just continue not being disappointed by almost every single purchase I make.

#53
Volourn

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A does somethings worse than O; but it does a lot better. It's a great expansion. I can think of only 2 maybe 3 expansions I have ever played that are as good or better than it.




#54
Guest_HK74_*

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I like Awakening, it's a nice epilogue to Origins and it's pretty satisfying as a stand-alone story. That said, it's too expensive for what is a relatively short and shallow experience compared to Origins. 2/3rds of the price of the original for about 1/4 the amount of content? That's a little steep.

#55
Mystiana

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I really enjoyed origins to the point where I actually finished it thanx to pulling 2 all-nighters in a row w/no naps...awakening taunting me the entire time at my side. I loved the char storylines and the relationships she had with her companions and was excited about continuing her story. When I got to the end and made the ultimate sacrifice, I had to scratch my head. How were they gonna pull that off in awakening??



Simple: they didn't...and worse, Al didn't even bat an eye. It's as if it didn't even happen. Basically I feel like BW gave me the finger on that one. Is expecting some consistency asking all that much? I mean, you invest hours on relationships with the other chars (all mine were at 90+), and your char just saved the world but the recognition with the npcs just doesn't exist.



The end even mentioned how your actions affected your companions' future lives and the world around you, but I'm guessing none of that's really in awakening either.



Am I just not giving awakening a chance? After all, I've only played maybe 30 min. but the consistency problems really bug me. Guess I'll just have to make a new char and start from scratch...let -them- go thru awakening instead and leave my warden exactly where she left off.


#56
Suzene

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My main disappointment was that Awakening felt more like someone trying to write a sequel to The Calling than an expansion for DA:O. The choices I made in the original game seemed to have little -- if any -- impact on carry over, and the main response to complaints that one of the big villains in the expansion seemed underdeveloped was that I needed to go buy another product. I wasn't impressed.

#57
tymtraveller

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I have to concur that by in large DA:A was not as complete of a product as it could have been.  In all games I play, I am all about the story, and the story in Awakenings is an interesting one.  Knowing that this was an expansion and not a complete game made its length more palatable (since I averaged 70+hrs on Origins).

My dissappointment was with the weak character development and basically the complete abandonment of my beloved original party.  If they are going to introduce other characters, I agree-the backstory needed to be more in depth.  Like Velanna: how can she so easily atone for doing the terrible things in her past, and the thread about her sister was just dropped.  Frankly I really hated that Oghren turned out in short order to be such a bum (though i guess I shouldnt be too shocked).  There was no PC/party dialogue/conversations except in specific circumstances either, and that was a dissappointment.  I also hate the fact (semi-spoiler alert) that I couldn't "win" totally in the end, It would seem the extra preparations are for naught depending on the choices made.  I mean what happens to all the rest of my companions if they meet an unfortunate end?  Does it even matter in future expansions?

I didn't notice any glitches in my version (PS3), save one thing-if it is a glitch: I lost my weapons, and much of my inventory from the original game.  My mage had no sword and no staff, my rogue lost his main sword. And what about all my cool stuff that was left in the party box at warden's keep (DLC on DA:O)?.  THAT irritated me to no end. 

The money gained from loot and cost of items I felt were a little better balanced except I still don't get why almost everything at a shop max's out at, say 10 sovreigns, except one "special" item that is like 150 gold.  I mean is this item REALLY worth that amount?  Frankly if I am going to buy something like that  I think it should really be a game-balance upsetter so I can at least feel it was money well spent.

I faced another similar issue, though to a lesser extent, in DA:A as in DA:O: why bother being a fighter?  Mages can carry swords and sling cool spells, and rogues can carry the same weapons as a fighter and have the extra bonus of lockpicking.  It just seems, especially in the introductory stages, that a fighter loses out on loot and xp by not being able to get into locked cases that are usually unavailable later once one has a rogue in the party.  Bioware handled this better in KOTOR by giving partial reward for breaking into containers when one couldn't pick a lock.  Why not do this here?

On the good side, I liked the expanded skills, spells, and the rune making.  I thought they were useful and a good expansion on the skill set.  I also appreciated the "do-over" option for skills.  Runemaking was interesting, but I needed planning (and a piece of paper) to keep track of what runes I needed for what and how many.  Not a big deal though.

All-in-all I agree with Game Infomer magazine's 7.75/10 rating for the game: DA:A is good, and lives up to its price tag, but doesn't have the "WOW" factor of the original.  Bioware is a victim of its own success:  they have spoiled us--we expect much out of this game designer and there is no reason that they cannot deliver.

#58
justin_sayne1

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Mad Note wrote...

Things that QA and testers should be ashamed of themselves for ignoring/missing (my game was played via PS3, not all bugs may be the same for PC and Xbox players of course):


It is actually insulting to QA Engineers everywhere for you to make this statement.  Software will have bugs.  Statement of fact.  Software will ship with bugs.  Another simple fact.

Rarely does QA (or even Development) get a say in which bugs are shipped versus having a product miss its date to get fixed.  A good company will have a Release Management team that does a Risk analysis before shipping, but some companies just let Product Managers shove it out the door.

#59
Dragon Age1103

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Mad Note wrote...

First off I'd like to take a moment to address all of the hardcore fans who will counter this thread with simple responses such as "This is only an expansion" or "The game is amazing it had no flaws" but lets not kid ourselves, take a serious glance at the product we've been given, and really consider if BioWare has honestly produced something they should be proud of or simply stuffed something onto the market to milk extra cash out of what was an amazing game (Origins).

As far as the argument of it was only an expansion lets consider what the purpose of an expansion is.  When other games come out with an expansion pack, it adds on content.  Adds new features, new improvements, and gives access to more in the form of an attachment to the original game.  Is there really any need to have played or even own Origins for this product?  You can start with a created character, little to none of the content travels over (with the exception of your gear and whether its Alistair or Anora giving a brief cameo), and none of the actual map of Origins is even used or accessable.  This is an entirely new game.  Copy/paste the combat system, add some new moves and new maps/enemies.  This is NOT, however, an extension to the original game, bottom line.  They have sold us a rushed and poorly produced sequel that lets you bring along an old model or make a new one.

Now, to move on to all the issues as to why this game is incredibly inferior to the original.  Should the game be an equal?  Of course not.  Should the game have an equal amount of content?  No, its an expansion.  Should the game dumb down the quality and gameplay value?  No, but it did. 

Things that QA and testers should be ashamed of themselves for ignoring/missing (my game was played via PS3, not all bugs may be the same for PC and Xbox players of course):

*Importing an Incomplete Character -- If you chose to import a character who has yet to finish the game, you are able to get a boost to be on par with the newly created one, level 18, however you do lose all your gear as it is replaced with a sub-standard pre-set of items.

*Armor of the Sentinel -- No one managed to notice the graphics for humans was glitched?  All play testers were dwarves and elves?

*Responses to a Female Warden -- Not one NPC has called my female character "My lady" or anything of that gender, its always sir.  "Please sir, help us" will say a commoner npc, or "Thank you sir"  for when you turn in quests.  Was this product truly so rushed they forgot you can create a female character?

*Character Statistics --  Apparently I've discovered 100% of the map before I left Vigil's Keep, and while my pc does 38% of the party damage, no one else in my party does above 5%.  My guess is they couldn't figure out how to reset the stats from Origins when the character moves over, but hey we wouldn't want to take any time making something with accuracy, right?

*Silverite Mines Equipment Loss -- One playthrough I was lucky, second one not so much.  Various items (yes all 4 experimental subjects were killed and looted) went missing.  Upon checking forums, it looks as if I wasn't the only one.  How is it no QA testers noticed any issues with gear disappearing for this little event?

*Orlesian Voice Acting --  It was made clear in Origins that Orlesians had "French" accents, however that seems to have been too much effort in this case.  Any Orlesian npc lacks an accent, and even more so if you created an Orlesian Warden you still have the exact same character voices as Origins, despite hailing from a foreign country.

*Manual of Focus --  Two issues here.  Not all characters can use the item, and its not consistant.  One game I can use it on some characters, the others I cannot.  The second issue is attribute resets.  Is there a penalty of losing stats when doing a reset?  Do you retain your stats via Mage Circle Fade event in Origins and the Fade event in Awakenings?  Because upon reset of stats, there was indeed a loss.

*Lord Guy Killed Twice --  If Lord Guy acts out you can order to have him killed.  But later, he'll attack you when you are working on the conspiracy quest line.  Its ok though, surely no one at QA expected you to have him killed.

*Various Graphic Bugs -- You're either very lucky or simply not being honest if you can claim you had no bug glitches.  A few of mine include Anders graphic simply disappearing at one point, Velanna's model being replaced with the roots that she appeared in for an entire dialoge sequence, and all the glitchy ghost dwarves anyone could wish for in Kal'Hirol.


All that on top of the fact they killed character depth with removing the option to speak with characters, killed the story of removing nearly all of your old companions despite their outcomes in the end of Origins, and watered down the gameplay to the point of making is easily played solo.

I had read that this was merely made to help wrap up the story of Origins.  As opposed to wrapping up an epic tale, this "expansion" gives me the image of a two year old tearing into a Christmas gift, quite the opposite of wrapping.  Loyal fans, we've been used.  $40 for 10 hours of content is an utter joke. This is the perfect example of milking a cash cow.  We were promised an expansion loaded with improvements.  Do you honestly feel that is what we were given?  I think not.



no offense but all of those are minor complaints that I rarely see as often as other bugs & I also noticed you don't have any of your games registered(which i know some have had problems with or claim to) so if you're leaving feedback off a torrent'd copy then that is just foolish.
    I've heard of bugs in Awakening & I've experienced a few & I know just b/c I haven't found the bug doesn't mean it isn't out there but I really doubt a legal  copy of this game has this many bugs & if it does you might want to check your mods or reinstall. Otherwise I see no reason to believe much about this long list of very minor complaints...sad to see it ruin an entire game for you.

#60
Drake Sigar

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I still don't understand how someone manages to complete Awakening in 10 hours, a speed The Flash would raise his eyebrows at. It took me 19 altogether.
You're right in one way, $40 for 10 hours of content is an utter joke. But that's not what me and the various UK residents have been paying, every online store I can find here prices the game at £15, which translates into a measly $23. That's right, we're paying half. Furthermore, your PC version on Amazon.com costs the same as the console version. This makes no sense.