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Mass Effect 3 Guns & Ammo


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#51
spartacusthegod

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tjzsf wrote...

spartacus: your story sounds more like an argument for why biotics were broken in ME1, as it seems like you didn't take damage because you were able to shut him down with biotics and tech, not because you were able to kill him quickly due to your gun never overheating. Now, if it is the same story with a different gun and no frictionless materials, then you may have a case.


Sorry, my story was meant to stress the ridiculous overpowered-ness that came about because of the modifications, both to guns AND armor.  The whole original modification system was broken as all hell.  Some weren't all that bad, but almost every single one of the high-level mods was absolutely broken.  

A pair of maxed out Medical Exoskeletons on a single character decreased their cooldown on EVERYTHING by over 50%, and a single Scram Rail X paired with Frictionless Materials X at least triples a gun's output before it overheats.

Combine that set of modifications, and you can tear through the final boss, what's supposed to be the ABSOLUTE HARDEST in the entire game, without having to cool down your gun once, and without taking a single shot.  Broken as all living hell and completely ridiculous.  

Modifié par spartacusthegod, 12 septembre 2011 - 04:37 .


#52
khevan

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spartacusthegod wrote...

Sorry, my story was meant to stress the ridiculous overpowered-ness that came about because of the modifications, both to guns AND armor.  The whole original modification system was broken as all hell.  Some weren't all that bad, but almost every single one of the high-level mods was absolutely broken.  

A pair of maxed out Medical Exoskeletons on a single character decreased their cooldown on EVERYTHING by over 50%, and a single Scram Rail X paired with Frictionless Materials X at least triples a gun's output before it overheats.

Combine that set of modifications, and you can tear through the final boss, what's supposed to be the ABSOLUTE HARDEST in the entire game, without having to cool down your gun once, and without taking a single shot.  Broken as all living hell and completely ridiculous.  


The issue with ME1's system wasn't the overheat mechanic, but the weapon mod system.  Saying that changing to an ammo system (with a different name) fixed this is like replacing a knee joint to fix a broken hip.  The knee wasn't broken, why replace it?

Yes, a bit of hyperbole there, but the point behind it is valid, in my opinion.  The infinite ammo, overheat/cooldown system worked well, up until you reached the point of end-game level weapons and modifications.  So why replace what worked?  I am of the opinion that the ammo system isn't evil incarnate.  It isn't perfect, but it works well enough, and the other changes to ME2's combat system make it a more fluid, faster paced experience.  But the same changes could have been made, while tweaking the infinite ammo system to make it fit into the new combat. 

Again, this is all my opinion.  I'm not upset by the change to an ammo-based system, but I am confused as to why it was necessary, considering the overheat mechanic gave ME1 a unique feel that I liked, even if ME2's combat is overall "better."  I'm also somewhat disappointed in Bioware's explanation of the change, lore-wise. 

Going from a system where the individual soldier/marine doesn't need to carry extra ammunition, to a system where the soldier/marine does need to carry that ammo simply doesn't make sense from a logistical standpoint.  And if there's one constant about just about any military out there, if something can do the same job, but cheaper, it's gonna go the cheaper route.  ME2's system requires more resupply to line units, which exposes more supply vehicles to front line fire, which can in the long run disrupt the logistical chain, even if a little bit, and that logistical chain is what the military runs on.  Beans and bullets, as the old saying goes.

Yes, I've rambled a bit in this post, but to sum up:  The Ammo system works, but it's generic.  ME1's system works, and was unique.  It needed tweaking to make up for the modification system, but it was ok.  The lore supports ME1's system, and Bioware shoe-horned in thermal clips for ME2.  While I'm ok with the ammo system in isolation, these other factors make me wish Bioware had kept ME1's system, and tweaked it to make it work with the new combat system.

#53
tjzsf

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spartacusthegod wrote...

Sorry, my story was meant to stress the ridiculous overpowered-ness that came about because of the modifications, both to guns AND armor.  The whole original modification system was broken as all hell.  Some weren't all that bad, but almost every single one of the high-level mods was absolutely broken.  

A pair of maxed out Medical Exoskeletons on a single character decreased their cooldown on EVERYTHING by over 50%, and a single Scram Rail X paired with Frictionless Materials X at least triples a gun's output before it overheats.

Combine that set of modifications, and you can tear through the final boss, what's supposed to be the ABSOLUTE HARDEST in the entire game, without having to cool down your gun once, and without taking a single shot.  Broken as all living hell and completely ridiculous.  

So, really, the problem is just that the high-end mods give you too big of a buff.
In which case the mechanics aren't broken - it'd be a perfectly good system if the percentages didn't increase so much with the possibility to stack bonuses like they were pancakes.
Ergo, the fix is simply to reduce the amount of bonus each mod gives you, not to create an entirely new system that doesn't really make sense lorewise and makes the series more generic gameplay-wise.

#54
capn233

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The only thing more generic though is that there is a reward for accuracy because ammo is limited. Like most other shooters.

I suppose with enough re-engineering the overheat mechanic could have worked in the second game. I don't think it makes the game any more fun though.

#55
Kscipher

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yes, the combat is more fun in the second game... but not because of the stupid ammo... adding more ammo capacity would fix that a bit... i don't know about anyone else, but if i was waging war on aliens i would have SO MUCH ammo with me... but i would rather have a gun with infinite bullets, of course... and if you really wanted a gun in ME1 that would overheat sometimes, you should have been using frictionless x2 and explosive ammo... i also miss being able to bombard enemies with ALL my biotics in the first game... the cooldown system takes too long for me, makes playing adepts (or any mage class) in 2 not so much fun...