lol not much but hey
im curious
Mhairi & the Joining [possible spoilers?]
Débuté par
TimelessWinter
, mars 23 2010 03:00
#1
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 03:00
TimelessWinter
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Sooo can Mhairi survive the joining or what?
lol not much but hey im curious
lol not much but hey
im curious
Retour en haut
#2
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 03:02
Thor Rand Al
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NO. She dies, there's no way to save her, sorry
#3
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 03:02
Efesell
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No, Mhairi just there so that you have help for the opening sequence.
She will die no matter what you do.
She will die no matter what you do.
#5
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 04:42
FigureThree
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She was kinda cool. I believe David Gaider said elsewhere that she was pretty much intended as "lady redshirt" but they fleshed her out a bit so that we wouldn't expect her death, thus giving it more impact, I'd imagine 
#6
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 04:52
Special_Agent_Goodwrench
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FigureThree wrote...
She was kinda cool. I believe David Gaider said elsewhere that she was pretty much intended as "lady redshirt" but they fleshed her out a bit so that we wouldn't expect her death, thus giving it more impact, I'd imagine
And it failed for the most part. Instead the people became pissed.
#7
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 05:03
Kryyptehk
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DrunkDeadman wrote...
FigureThree wrote...
She was kinda cool. I believe David Gaider said elsewhere that she was pretty much intended as "lady redshirt" but they fleshed her out a bit so that we wouldn't expect her death, thus giving it more impact, I'd imagine
And it failed for the most part. Instead the people became pissed.
No, it succeeded because people were pissed. It would have failed if people didn't care. I don't care because I didn't want to spoil myself, so I didn't look at her trailer or anything. So.... Bioware=1, Fans=0
#8
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 05:15
EmperorSahlertz
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The fact that people got pissed just shows it worked perfectly.DrunkDeadman wrote...
FigureThree wrote...
She was kinda cool. I believe David Gaider said elsewhere that she was pretty much intended as "lady redshirt" but they fleshed her out a bit so that we wouldn't expect her death, thus giving it more impact, I'd imagine
And it failed for the most part. Instead the people became pissed.
#9
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 05:24
Efesell
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Eh, it worked out okay I guess.
I think she needed another mission, gotta get players a little more invested in the character before you drop the bridge on them.
I think she needed another mission, gotta get players a little more invested in the character before you drop the bridge on them.
#10
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 05:25
Sarah1281
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Why do people keep assuming that something your character can say or do will affect whether NPCs are physically able to withstand the taint?
#11
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 05:32
casedawgz
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My initial thought was that she bought it because I was a warrior, and that being a mage would have killed Anders, but it didn't prove to be the case. Good thing, too, because even had Mhairi been more fleshed out she'd probably pale in comparison to having Ser Pounce-a-Lot around.
#12
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 05:36
Special_Agent_Goodwrench
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You got me wrong there. It failed because people were pissed because the whole death was quite pointless. We know almost nothing of Mhairi and then she just dies like a regular redshirt. If we knew her for longer time before the Joining and began to care about her, THEN they would have suceeded. Otherwise its just - "Oops, dead. Moving on..."EmperorSahlertz wrote...
The fact that people got pissed just shows it worked perfectly.DrunkDeadman wrote...
FigureThree wrote...
She was kinda cool. I believe David Gaider said elsewhere that she was pretty much intended as "lady redshirt" but they fleshed her out a bit so that we wouldn't expect her death, thus giving it more impact, I'd imagine
And it failed for the most part. Instead the people became pissed.
I felt no emotion, no sadness, when Mhairi bit the dust.
#13
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 05:36
Efesell
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Sarah1281 wrote...
Why do people keep assuming that something your character can say or do will affect whether NPCs are physically able to withstand the taint?
To be fair, I've seen stranger things in games. Plus you do gain approval with the character, that does tend to lead to the idea she might be saveable.
#14
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 05:38
Kryyptehk
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Efesell wrote...
Sarah1281 wrote...
Why do people keep assuming that something your character can say or do will affect whether NPCs are physically able to withstand the taint?
To be fair, I've seen stranger things in games. Plus you do gain approval with the character, that does tend to lead to the idea she might be saveable.
That's true. Maybe she was originally supposed to be a main character but they didn't have time to implement her. So they cut out the boring character.
#15
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 08:56
Hyper Cutter
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Except that they were getting angry for completely different reasons than Bioware intended, and I doubt people getting angry at Bioware was part of the plan...EmperorSahlertz wrote...
The fact that people got pissed just shows it worked perfectly.DrunkDeadman wrote...
FigureThree wrote...
She was kinda cool. I believe David Gaider said elsewhere that she was pretty much intended as "lady redshirt" but they fleshed her out a bit so that we wouldn't expect her death, thus giving it more impact, I'd imagine
And it failed for the most part. Instead the people became pissed.
Because Bioware'sSarah1281 wrote...
Why do people keep assuming that
something your character can say or do will affect whether NPCs are
physically able to withstand the taint?
last game literally gave you (indirectly and directly) the power of life
and death over your entire squad?
#16
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 09:44
Noilly Prat
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I have sort of mixed feelings about the whole thing.
Mostly I like what they did with Mhairi. A tiny part of me was a little annoyed, though, not because she died, but because prerelease preview materials seemed to suggest that she would be one of the main party members... she even got a trailer before the game came out. Part of me feels like this was cheap, and that if BioWare had wanted her death to make a bigger impact than the usual beginning-of-game temporary party member death scenario, they ought to have relied only on in-game character development, and not misleading advertising.
Another part of me thinks that the deception (if you want to call it that) was a great idea, because nowadays we tend to expect to know who at least most of our party members will be before a game like this is released. This is unquestionably venturing into spoiler territory, but usually the only way to avoid it is to just avoid the prerelease marketing stuff. It must be more difficult for developers to keep things like this relatively secret, now, and because of that, I think that the Mhairi thing was kind of a clever trick.
Anyway.
Mostly I like what they did with Mhairi. A tiny part of me was a little annoyed, though, not because she died, but because prerelease preview materials seemed to suggest that she would be one of the main party members... she even got a trailer before the game came out. Part of me feels like this was cheap, and that if BioWare had wanted her death to make a bigger impact than the usual beginning-of-game temporary party member death scenario, they ought to have relied only on in-game character development, and not misleading advertising.
Another part of me thinks that the deception (if you want to call it that) was a great idea, because nowadays we tend to expect to know who at least most of our party members will be before a game like this is released. This is unquestionably venturing into spoiler territory, but usually the only way to avoid it is to just avoid the prerelease marketing stuff. It must be more difficult for developers to keep things like this relatively secret, now, and because of that, I think that the Mhairi thing was kind of a clever trick.
Anyway.
Modifié par Noilly Prat, 23 mars 2010 - 09:45 .
#17
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 09:55
jsachun
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Well, the funny thing was I knew about it before I played the game. I suppose it was epic fail for Bioware to have different release date for different regions. I was pissed, because she was the only appropriate companion for a Templar spec. But I had to do with dispell magic from Anders & Velanna, which meant I had to spend 6 sovs. just for the respec book.
#18
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 09:55
blademaster7
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While I didn't like seeing Mhairi die, I kinda liked the fact that her death was predetermined and not some kind of lame mini-game that you'll end up reloading to get right.
Seriously, it would have been lame if life and death was based on approval as people speculated before the release. Most people expected that helping Nate with his family issues and saving Anders from the templars would be a perquisite for their survival.
I was looking really forward of getting to know Mhairi and her death caught me off-guard. But that's the irony of being a Grey Warden. Good men and women die and criminals get to live.
Seriously, it would have been lame if life and death was based on approval as people speculated before the release. Most people expected that helping Nate with his family issues and saving Anders from the templars would be a perquisite for their survival.
I was looking really forward of getting to know Mhairi and her death caught me off-guard. But that's the irony of being a Grey Warden. Good men and women die and criminals get to live.
#19
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 09:59
VampireCommando
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it worked on me, i was totally shocked, i mean why list her as a main character and give her a trailer of her own, codex entries and the like, i mean when she copped it i was like
OMG WTF, came on here and read that its was intention by Darth Gaider to give it more impact and show that anyone can die in the joining i thought well fair enough then becasue it worked perfectly on me
OMG WTF, came on here and read that its was intention by Darth Gaider to give it more impact and show that anyone can die in the joining i thought well fair enough then becasue it worked perfectly on me
#20
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 12:25
Bigdoser
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I found her annoying plus she did not even have a background image in her life potrait so i pretty much knew she was gonna kick the bucket.
#21
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 12:49
Sabriana
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Bioware = 1 and Fans = 0 is not really a good marketing and PR idea, Kryyptehk .
It should have come out: Bioware = 1, and Fans = 1. That would have been a success.
The biggest problem was that Mhairi was something new, something rare, and something full of potential. For dramatic impact, surely they could've thought of something else. Like killing off Oghren. Right there at the joining. The only one of the companions that we all felt something for, not a pixel person nobody got to know and nobody cared about personally. What exited people was what she could have become, not what she was at that point.
Lets be honest, her death was almost a given right from the get-go. She was all gung ho about joining - shades of Daveth. There were 5 new and one old companion announced, and Mhairi came as a sudden after-thought, making it 6 new and 1 old. And then later on in-game, after the mage and Oghren survived, I knew she'd be the token dead initiate.
Aside from that she was the only S&S warrior and tank at the time. I'm sorry, Oghren is a good DPS when developed properly, but he's not a tank. So the player had to wait for Justice, who, depending on the play-through, could come quite late in the game. The only exiting prospect to develop in-game was Mhairi.
Sorry again, but Anders fell flat, as did Velanna. Same for Sigrun, and Oghren was awful. I loved him in Origins, but in Awakenings he left me cold and non-caring. Oghren was another character with a lot of potential of the 'utterly broken, devastated, fallen anti-hero' man, and all was not realized.
I don't own the game, I only played a little on a friend's computer and watched two play-throughs. But honestly, had they killed off Oghren at the joining, I would have been quite upset. Had he been killed later on, sadly I wouldn't have cared any longer.
It should have come out: Bioware = 1, and Fans = 1. That would have been a success.
The biggest problem was that Mhairi was something new, something rare, and something full of potential. For dramatic impact, surely they could've thought of something else. Like killing off Oghren. Right there at the joining. The only one of the companions that we all felt something for, not a pixel person nobody got to know and nobody cared about personally. What exited people was what she could have become, not what she was at that point.
Lets be honest, her death was almost a given right from the get-go. She was all gung ho about joining - shades of Daveth. There were 5 new and one old companion announced, and Mhairi came as a sudden after-thought, making it 6 new and 1 old. And then later on in-game, after the mage and Oghren survived, I knew she'd be the token dead initiate.
Aside from that she was the only S&S warrior and tank at the time. I'm sorry, Oghren is a good DPS when developed properly, but he's not a tank. So the player had to wait for Justice, who, depending on the play-through, could come quite late in the game. The only exiting prospect to develop in-game was Mhairi.
Sorry again, but Anders fell flat, as did Velanna. Same for Sigrun, and Oghren was awful. I loved him in Origins, but in Awakenings he left me cold and non-caring. Oghren was another character with a lot of potential of the 'utterly broken, devastated, fallen anti-hero' man, and all was not realized.
I don't own the game, I only played a little on a friend's computer and watched two play-throughs. But honestly, had they killed off Oghren at the joining, I would have been quite upset. Had he been killed later on, sadly I wouldn't have cared any longer.
#22
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 01:10
gskurski
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My girlfriend was watching me play when the Joining Ritual part came up. We laughed when Oghren burped, and were relieved when Anders made it out fine. But when Mhairi just dropped dead she turned to me and said, "Is that supposed to happen?" and all I could say was "Nooo, she's supposed to be a main character! She had a trailer and everything!", and then I realized that it would be ridiculous odds for all three to survive, given that only the Warden survived out of three and Alistair states, "2 more dead... only one died in mine [as if this were unusual], but it was horrible...".
I guess I actually started realizing she was going to die after the seneschal said that Anders survived. I was just so convinced that she was supposed to survive. It was the approval rating bonus that got me. None of the other meat-shields that Bioware gave us in Origins had approval rating changes.
I'll admit though, within 5 minutes I went running to the internet just to confirm I didn't do something wrong.
I guess I actually started realizing she was going to die after the seneschal said that Anders survived. I was just so convinced that she was supposed to survive. It was the approval rating bonus that got me. None of the other meat-shields that Bioware gave us in Origins had approval rating changes.
I'll admit though, within 5 minutes I went running to the internet just to confirm I didn't do something wrong.
#23
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 01:30
Venatio
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Ya, heres the word from Gaider himself:
Also, obfuscated definition.
ob·fus·cate
–verb (used with object),-cat·ed, -cat·ing.
1.
to confuse, bewilder, or stupefy.
2.
to make obscure or unclear: to obfuscate a problem with extraneous information.
3.
to darken.
Its a shame, she would have made a nice addition to the team.
David Gaider wrote...
Quite the opposite, actually. Mhairi was never intended to be a full companion, and for a while she was just "Lady Redshirt", the warrior that accompanied you briefly to make sure you had some help at the very beginning of the game. Later we filled her out with a bit more personality and obfuscated the fact that she was intended to die in the Joining -- why? Because if we hadn't there would have been just as many people going "Oh, I KNEW she was intended to die all along! How lame!"Soapy wrote...
Mhairi is in a few previews, and it almost seems like shes apart of the game later on. Was her death last minute?
Her voice actress did a great job, though. I wouldn't have minded seeing her as a full companion. That said, we promised you six companions and that's what you got -- she's the "seventh" as well as the odd man out, so to speak. Sorry some people were disappointed, but it's nice to see they were surprised.
Also, obfuscated definition.
ob·fus·cate
–verb (used with object),-cat·ed, -cat·ing.
1.
to confuse, bewilder, or stupefy.
2.
to make obscure or unclear: to obfuscate a problem with extraneous information.
3.
to darken.
Its a shame, she would have made a nice addition to the team.
Modifié par Venatio, 23 mars 2010 - 01:34 .
#24
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 01:44
Nioxide
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As soon as I saw her I thought..oh sh*t its Ensign Ricky.
#25
Posté 23 mars 2010 - 01:49
rabbitchannel
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I was surprised! I was all, "NOOOOOO!" I quite liked her. BW did a great job. Didn't see it coming. Also, it helped that I didn't spoil anything for myself. I saw Ander's and Velanna's trailers but nothing else.
