44 réponses à ce sujet

[Akinra]

Spyndel wrote...

Adanu wrote...

Don't you people *dare* tell me how to play my games. You get your Nightmare difficulty ramp up from mods or the devs... let the rest of us who don't want to have to fight spirit dragon level fights each fight have our normal.

Then, when you conquer *that*, make your own mod to make it so that you fight whatever being is supposed to be the Maker in every fight.

Yes, I'm completely and totally sick of people who complain that no difficulty is good enough... they always want more until it's to the point of one of those custom Mario levels where you *CANNOT* make a mistake or you will die instantly.

Relax. Nobody is saying Dragon age needs to be tougher overall on the easy difficulty settings, if that is what you are happy with.  People just wanted a challenge that was at least consistent with Origins, which Awakening was not, even on Nightmare difficulty.

It would be nice to have a campaign that was actually designed for the high level characters in it.  Characters in Awakenings are much more powerful, but the enemies don't scale in impressiveness enough to compensate.

And, by the way, on Nightmare difficulty, my party ran through and used simple auto attacks to kill the Spirit Dragon in one try. Surely one can see there is an issue here.

Nobody on here has told you how to play your game. If you want to play on easy or normal that's fine, nobody's judging you for that. But for those of us who want more of a challenge from our games, we expect 'hard' and 'nightmare' to do what they say on the tin so to speak. At the minute on nightmare when I can bring whoever I want for any fight, not need to bother with any tactics and cake walk every fight then there's something wrong. On origins I played nightmare once and then stuck to hard as I felt it was the right mix of challenge and enjoyment.

As others have said, I just want easy to be easy, hard to be hard and nightmare to be a real b*tch. In awakenings this isn't the case.

[Hoplonite]

I also would want to have the nightmare mode to really be a hard struggle. In DA:A nightmare I never used any resistance buffs from potions, I never switched the gear to certain boss fights, I never changed the runestones in armor and weapons to match the fight, etc.



Take the spirit dragon for example. It could be killed with 2 characters without even touching mana bottles on the mage with heals. And the final boss fight ... it was a disappointment that you can just go in there without no knowledge of what you're gonna face, and then win the fight on first go. That could be done on easy or maybe normal difficulty, but nightmare? No thanks.



It's perfectly ok that some enjoy the story and want to play it as if reading a book. They should go and pick the easy or normal mode. I want to bash my head to wall due to repeatedly failing fights. It shouldn't be that hard to really make the nightmare mode nightmarish.

[Killyox the Defender]

Accesibility? WTF? That why there is very easy, easy, normal, hard, nightmare difficult levels, besides that all are ridiculously easy.



Nightmare should be exactly what it sounds A NIGHTMARE, freaking HARD, tactics required gameplay, not just get in attack and win....



Difficulty is easy peasy:S at least in origins on nightmare it was somewhat hard, now its pathetic for ME it realllllyyyy takes away a lot enjoyement

[Killyox the Defender]

Hoplonite wrote...

I also would want to have the nightmare mode to really be a hard struggle. In DA:A nightmare I never used any resistance buffs from potions, I never switched the gear to certain boss fights, I never changed the runestones in armor and weapons to match the fight, etc.

Take the spirit dragon for example. It could be killed with 2 characters without even touching mana bottles on the mage with heals. And the final boss fight ... it was a disappointment that you can just go in there without no knowledge of what you're gonna face, and then win the fight on first go. That could be done on easy or maybe normal difficulty, but nightmare? No thanks.

It's perfectly ok that some enjoy the story and want to play it as if reading a book. They should go and pick the easy or normal mode. I want to bash my head to wall due to repeatedly failing fights. It shouldn't be that hard to really make the nightmare mode nightmarish.

TBH i have used any 0 Healing potion and maybe 3-4 mana potions during my 1st walkthrough @nightmare lvl DA:A, Spirit dragon i did with 3 chars, baronness was almost done with 2 chars, i havent used ANY resistance balms, i havent used ANY anti-undead or anti-darkspawn weapons, zero paralysis runes, zero slow runes.

Nightmare isis like a sweet dream - zero difficulty

[gskurski]

schwerttau wrote...

Point is: difficulty of nightmare of DA:A is not the same as it was in DA:O. After I finished DA:A I continued DA:O on another char and was wondering why I was dying all the time.. then I realized, the difficulty was not set just for DA:A but for the whole DA:O/DA:A-installation. Switched back to hard and was fine. I turned on nightmare for DA:A because hard was so easy. Well nightmare wasn't that much harder, never lost a party member during combat.

Same thing happened to me. I went back to finish up Origins with my mage and I kept dying. It wasn't that I had to change the difficulty, it was just that I got so used not needing to even pay attention during anything but elite boss battles in Awakenings.

[Killyox the Defender]

heh why are some ppl outraged that others want harder game?



Easy should be EASY and Nightmare should be NIGHTMARE, period, no discussion.



TBH i think ill make new char in DAO from scratch and go on nightmare from start.

[immortallogic]

of course its going to be easy when you min/max and spa, the strongest spells over and over, try doing something different...

[Zocat]

immortallogic wrote...

of course its going to be easy when you min/max and spa, the strongest spells over and over, try doing something different...

No - it shouldn't be easy when min/maxing on NIGHTMARE.
Of course it should be easy on nightmare, when you splitpull the groups (as this is imho exploiting the mechanic).
I want a challenge when playing nightmare the "normal" way.

Mind - I havent finished Awakenings yet (some bugs forced me to reload multiple times).
But I remember some fights in Origings, where I had to constantly micro every character - use poisons / flasks / traps.
In Awakening it's like "run main char (tank) into the group, switch to mage CC the enemy casters/ranged, switch to main press taunt, activate carapace" Maybe toss a healing spell or do a griveous insult. I dont ever switch to my melee (rogue) or ranged (rogue).

I dont even want to know how the difficulty would even decrease more, when I start to min/max on a "global party level" as in using a 2 caster setup (with mass paralysis or sleep, 2 force fields, 2 crushing prisons, 2 cones of cold, ...) or get Oghren and my warrior Massacre ....
Or having a mainchar mage and running with 3 mages and one tank...

Also the "maxlevel" for each zone has to go. I want all enemies to scale to my character level at any time.
Maybe they should increase the enemy level for playerlevel+1 (or +2/+3) in nightmare...

Just checked in the Wending Wood: There is a group of darkspawn consiting of some minions lv 13-15. And one Alpha level 25. My mainchar (and party) is lv 26..... Why aren't those minions not lv 25+ also?

Modifié par Zocat, 24 mars 2010 - 03:53 .

[Llames]

DELETED.. Im so cute.

Modifié par Llames, 24 mars 2010 - 04:34 .

[Psychoray]

immortallogic wrote...

of course its going to be easy when you min/max and spa, the strongest spells over and over, try doing something different...

A party that uses only auto attack (no abilities) and no potions can finish almost every fight in Awakening. On nightmare.

In my opinion, min maxing should be a neccesity to even have a chance of surviving in nightmare mode. It's called nightmare mode for a reason.

The people that don't want to min/max, don't want to pause etc should play on easy/normal. The harder difficulties shouldn't be toned down for them.

[Noilly Prat]

My impression was that either combat was balanced for new characters, or the high level talents and spells are overpowered, or the game is just a lot easier than Origins overall.

Let me say that I am NOT the sort of player who enjoys ramping up the difficulty level of a game.  This has no appeal to me at all.  I never do it.  Normal was plenty tough for me in Origins.  I imported a level 23 rogue into Awakening, and had a niggling feeling all along that the game was really easy.  Finally, over halfway through, I decided to try Hard, and found that too easy, so I bumped it up to Nightmare for the rest of the game.  I ought to have done it earlier, too.

Again, making every encounter an enormous challenge is not fun for me.  But being able to blow through a game like this without ever having to pause and micromanage combat, not having any incentive to mess around with runecrafting because I'm already doing fine without it, not having to use potions or injury kits at all, and only having a single character in my party die once or twice in battle for the whole game (at least while the difficulty was set to Normal)... well, this isn't much fun for me, either.  The thing that really made up my mind was when I realized that I hadn't even tried any of the new, high level talents two-thirds of the way through the game, because I just didn't need them and the enemies all seemed to die before I had a chance.

Playing on Nightmare I thought was reasonable, though still easier than Origins on Normal.

[Haexpane]

I would have to agree about runecrafting, after getting a few grandmaster and paragon runes, and not having that change combat much I stopped bothering (on hard)



Should have done nightmare too

[jellmoo32]

I agree. The difficulty is too low. I play Origins on Normal or Hard, depending on my mood. I find those levels to be perfect for me. I don't want it so hard that I feel like crying, but I want the possibility of losing to exist. So I started Awakenings on Normal, and realized I wasn't even paying attention. Pretty much just clicking on an enemy every now and then. Bumped it up to hard and realized that I was never pausing, nor coordinating my party outside of the PC. Bumped it up to Nightmare, and while I have to pause and coordinate the team, I have not bothered with enchantments nor using any but the most basic of tactics. Like I said, I'm not interested in uber hard battles, nor am I a even a great video game player, I just want a difficulty setting where I have to, you know, pay attention.

[Entropy]

I played Awakening on Nightmare and still felt like I was playing casual. The only time I had a challenge was the very last fight, and only because my character kept getting overwhelmed. Though after actually using some tactics and not just rushing in swinging, it was fairly easy. I was disappointed with how quickly Awakening went by, but it's just an expansion. :/

[DJ0000]

The problem with Awakening is that they gave you a lot of new talents that are I win buttons against lesser enemies like Massacre, Nature's Vengance and Flicker but didn't add anymore higher level enemies.

The problem is, they saw people saying mages are overpowered and thought, "Okay how can we pump up Warriors and Rogues to match". Rather than this I think I would have preferred them to say "Well, you think they are overpowered, don't use them".

As a warrior I found that every single battle could be won with a single tactic activate Spirit Warrior sustain , run in, taunt, massacre. In fact, I stopped using this because it was boring just killing everything in less than 3 seconds. A similar mage tactic is run in, One with Nature, Nature's Vengance or even Hand of Winter.

A simple solution to please everyone is to leave it as is on lower difficulties and on Hard replace a some normal enemies with elites, then on nightmare nerf Nature's Vengance, Massacre, etc so you can no longer to 400 damage to elites with a single shot.

For me, the difficulty of the main game was not a problem, in the first few plays it was reasonably challenging(just think of the first time you fought Gaxkang) but in Awakening the new talents and items make it too easy to overpower yourself because the enemies siply don't gain anywhere near as much more power as you do.

Some may say "simple solution, don't use the new stuff" but to be fair if I'm paying £31, I'm making the most of the new stuff.

edit: Just thought I should add, I don't want ridiculous Demon's Souls difficulty, I hated that, I just want to not be able to win every mob battle in 3 seconds and every boss battle, besides the last, in less than 40 seconds. I'm not even a soloer and it was that easy.

Modifié par DJ0000, 24 mars 2010 - 09:41 .

[Lord_and_Master]

Spell Singer wrote...

It is a script based system. By definition that means you can "game" the game. Once you do that the difficulty level plummets like a rock. There is no solution to this. You can make the creatures tougher, and harder hitting but you can't give them the ability to out think a human who can learn and adapt. I play on hard as that is good balance between challenge and avoiding long and tedious fights.

Complaining about it is largely pointless. The only way for you to make the combats harder is to NOT indulge in behavior that you know will exploit the script weaknesses. And that is all there is to be done since scripts are simply not flexible while humans are.

I recall from DMing online all that I needed to do to up the difficulty level was apply a bit of direct DM intervention. Things like telling a fighter to charge any mage I saw stopped to cast a spell. Set up a nice ambush using special groups. Grab those creatures and move them there. Do a bit of tweeking to skins or stats as well but those were less important then my direct intervention in a fight. But writing a script that would simulate that? And more to the point would be effective more than once...since when you die you get to try again. It took me most of an afternoon to figure out the battlemaster fight to rescue Liara in ME and the solution isn't something I'm proud of since it is nonsensical but it works and nothing else I tried did.

Just because it's scripted doesn't mean it needs to be stupid and non-reactive to the human players actions.

if (mage stops to cast spell)
{
    Stun mage;
}
else
{
   Nuke tank;
}

Hell with as advanced as all the tactics options are they wouldn't even need to hardcode any of the stuff, just make the AI more responsive to what a player is doing.

I beat awakening with my eyes closed, and when I decided to try it again with the new grey warden starting character I said, "I'll crank the difficulty up because that was too simple"

...

It was already on nightmare. 


And no - the solution isn't to "Not learn the strategy of the fight" so you can make it harder by doing it completely wrong.  That's just dumb.

The script CAN be as responsive as a human if they coded in more if/then statements.  The problem is they give them all basic actions with little or no responses to what a player does.

They could easily say...

if (party == ftr & ftr & rog & mage)
{
     super speciual secret attack on (mage);
}

and nuke the healer every fight.  so you bring 2 healers. well then
if (party == ftr & mage & mage & rog)
{
    super special nuke on mage 1;
    Spawn uber tentacle of "knock mage down";
}

Then it's still tough as nails.  The problem is they didn't sit down and playtest player responses, and they didn't code reactions to the typical responses.  They rushed it with bad AI instead.

 

[Grimx0r]

Upper Krust you have some great ideas there. It quite neatly sums up what makes me go and play through BG2 once a year. Depending on class composition and available spells, every major encounter could be played differently. None of this mmo-style gear-whoring then charging Diablo-style through weak mobs.

[Adanu]

Go do a BG remake if you people want BG so badly. That, or use difficulty mods.

[Chewableprozac]

Adanu wrote...

Go do a BG remake if you people want BG so badly. That, or use difficulty mods.

you come across as pretty selfish. no one is asking easy/normal to be changed at the expense of the casual gamers. but you're demeaning those who don't want the very hardest difficulty available to be a cakewalk?

[Haexpane]

Does the enemy AI even recognize class differences? It feels like they just go for whoever is doing the most damage