230 réponses à ce sujet

[Bann Duncan]

My first Shep was Paragon, so he had the fleet focus on Sovereign, thinking that thousands of soldiers' lives were not worth throwing away just to replace three replaceable politicians. My Renegade Shepard was going to save the Council as she thought the sacrifice of those soldiers would be for the greater good as the suvival of those three would help ensure galactic stability.



However, after playing ME2, my next Paragon playthrough had Shep save the council, since ME2 reveals that the Council were on a Ship with 10 000 people, so it then agreed with his conscious to save them.

[Tilarta]

CmdrFenix83 wrote...
Well, no one's discussing that option.  It's more about whether or not you deem that losing the ships to save them is worth it if those lost ships could cause your fleet to lose to Sovereign.

I won anyway, so apparently, it doesn't make a difference.

But flipside, the Destiny Ascension is a flying space cannon of massive proportions.

If things had soured, even in an extreme state of damage, I'd still want it around to take on Soverign.

Besides, the Geth ships targeting the Destiny Ascension never got a chance to fire back.
They were gunned down as soon as the Alliance fleet came through the Mass Relay.

And the rest of them received similar treatment.

So, from a strategic standpoint, you lose nothing by saving the Council and gain one big space cannon that you may need later.

[sipaufade]

 it best the best choice for the galaxy. my shep still feels that way even if they counselors aren't really helping. he's just resigned to the fact that he's the only one who really knows whats comming and noone can really help him so he's just gonna save the galaxy by his self

[Jax Sparrow]

Barquiel wrote...

• the asari councilor is hot <3

Q.4T.

[CmdrFenix83]

Tilarta wrote...

CmdrFenix83 wrote...
Well, no one's discussing that option.  It's more about whether or not you deem that losing the ships to save them is worth it if those lost ships could cause your fleet to lose to Sovereign.

I won anyway, so apparently, it doesn't make a difference.

But flipside, the Destiny Ascension is a flying space cannon of massive proportions.

If things had soured, even in an extreme state of damage, I'd still want it around to take on Soverign.

Besides, the Geth ships targeting the Destiny Ascension never got a chance to fire back.
They were gunned down as soon as the Alliance fleet came through the Mass Relay.

And the rest of them received similar treatment.

So, from a strategic standpoint, you lose nothing by saving the Council and gain one big space cannon that you may need later.

The Ascension's main drive was offline.  That ship wasn't going to be participating in the fight against Sovereign in any situation. 

In hindsight, though, you know the Alliance lost 8 cruisers saving the Ascension(Talk to the reporter on the Citadel in ME2 for these numbers).  You are expecting casualties when you send them in.  In a pure 'save the most lives possible' mindset, and using hindsight, yes, saving the Ascension is the right call(crew of 10,000 at the cost of 8 ships with 800 a piece for 6400, a net saving of 3600 lives).  Going in, you have no way to know how many you're going to lose, nor if the casualties will result in the ultimate defeat against Sovereign.

It's a gamble, and one that pays off because BioWare spoonfeeds the fairytale 'happy-ending' for all Paragon decisions.

[MarkusWhatever]

Jax Sparrow wrote...

Barquiel wrote...

• the asari councilor is hot <3

Q.4T.

and she still owes Shep a reward for saving her life...

[devilsgrin]

Tilarta wrote...

CmdrFenix83 wrote...
Well, no one's discussing that option.  It's more about whether or not you deem that losing the ships to save them is worth it if those lost ships could cause your fleet to lose to Sovereign.

I won anyway, so apparently, it doesn't make a difference.

But flipside, the Destiny Ascension is a flying space cannon of massive proportions.

If things had soured, even in an extreme state of damage, I'd still want it around to take on Soverign.

Besides, the Geth ships targeting the Destiny Ascension never got a chance to fire back.
They were gunned down as soon as the Alliance fleet came through the Mass Relay.

And the rest of them received similar treatment.

So, from a strategic standpoint, you lose nothing by saving the Council and gain one big space cannon that you may need later.

this...

the Destiny Ascension can be saved immediately upon the Alliance's arrival... Sovereign cannot be attacked until the wards re-open. The DA was the best option for the moment, its called "two birds, one stone" Save the DA and Destroy Sovereign. Remember, Shep is brilliant in practically all military fields... understanding Space combat would be one of them. Any Shep would know that Sovereign is pretty much free to do what it wants until the wards open, and that the Destiny Ascension is too big an assett to lose waiting for a chance to attack sovereign.

Modifié par devilsgrin, 24 mars 2010 - 08:39 .

[Wildecker]

CmdrFenix83 wrote...
Well, no one's discussing that option.  It's more about whether or not you deem that losing the ships to save them is worth it if those lost ships could cause your fleet to lose to Sovereign.

Well, consider this: if you save their sorry behinds from being fried right now and with communication and mass relay transport at your service again, the Turian Councilor might start yelling at his own navy to move anything that can fire a shot to the Citadel, ASAP.  That should easily make up for your losses during the rescue.

The Alliance 5th Fleet was just the first to respond because Joker had tipped them off that something BAD was going to happen. I have no doubt that all across Council space the military went to high alert the minute the Citadel stopped communicating and the mass relays stopped working ...

Modifié par Wildecker, 24 mars 2010 - 08:42 .

[CmdrFenix83]

devilsgrin wrote...

this /\\\\\\\\/\\\\\\\\.
the Destiny Ascension can be saved immediately upon the Alliance's arrival... Sovereign cannot be attacked until the wards re-open. The DA was the best option for the moment, its called "two birds, one stone" Save the DA and Destroy Sovereign. Remember, Shep is brilliant in practically all military fields... understanding Space combat would be one of them. Any Shep would know that Sovereign is pretty much free to do what it wants until the wards open, and that the Destiny Ascension is too big an assett to lose waiting for a chance to attack sovereign.

Again, ignores the cost of 8 functional cruisers.  The neutral option isn't letting the Council die for fun.  It's saving those ships for Sovereign, because it's believed that we increase the odds of losing by sarcificing battle-ready ships to save one that's essentially disabled. 

There's nothing long-term being considered, only the immediate threat that *has* to be stopped right now.  Doing anything that risks this victory is completely illogical.  I would really love it if ME3 included several PARAGON(and let me make this clear, I play zero renegade characters.  I have 8 paragons and 2 paragades) options that ended up resulting in very bad outcomes.  Things that are obvious, like the Rachni decision should have been, where choosing to be the naive idealist actually results in it coming back to bite ya in the ass.  None of this "Well, we're gonna win anyway, so might as well save everyone that I can!"

Modifié par CmdrFenix83, 24 mars 2010 - 08:45 .

[CmdrFenix83]

Wildecker wrote...

CmdrFenix83 wrote...
Well, no one's discussing that option.  It's more about whether or not you deem that losing the ships to save them is worth it if those lost ships could cause your fleet to lose to Sovereign.

Well, consider this: if you save their sorry behinds from being fried right now and with communication and mass relay transport at your service again, the Turian Councilor might start yelling at his own navy to move anything that can fire a shot to the Citadel, ASAP.  That should easily make up for your losses during the rescue.

The Alliance 5th Fleet was just the first to respond because Joker had tipped them off that something BAD was going to happen. I have no doubt that all across Council space the military went to high alert the minute the Citadel stopped communicating and the mass relays stopped working ...

Unless they're parked at a relay that connects to the Citadel, it would be hours before a single ship arrives from that(FTL isn't instant).  No way of knowing whatsoever.  Sovereign might have obliterated all resistance by then and these 'reinforcements' could arrive just in time to die to the Reaper fleet.

[the_last_krogan]

because im a hero

thats what heroes do

[devilsgrin]

CmdrFenix83 wrote...

devilsgrin wrote...

this /\\/\\.
the Destiny Ascension can be saved immediately upon the Alliance's arrival... Sovereign cannot be attacked until the wards re-open. The DA was the best option for the moment, its called "two birds, one stone" Save the DA and Destroy Sovereign. Remember, Shep is brilliant in practically all military fields... understanding Space combat would be one of them. Any Shep would know that Sovereign is pretty much free to do what it wants until the wards open, and that the Destiny Ascension is too big an assett to lose waiting for a chance to attack sovereign.

Again, ignores the cost of 8 functional cruisers.  The neutral option isn't letting the Council die for fun.  It's saving those ships for Sovereign, because it's believed that we increase the odds of losing by sarcificing battle-ready ships to save one that's essentially disabled. 

There's nothing long-term being considered, only the immediate threat that *has* to be stopped right now.  Doing anything that risks this victory is completely illogical.  I would really love it if ME3 included several PARAGON(and let me make this clear, I play zero renegade characters.  I have 8 paragons and 2 paragades) options that ended up resulting in very bad outcomes.  Things that are obvious, like the Rachni decision should have been, where choosing to be the naive idealist actually results in it coming back to bite ya in the ass.  None of this "Well, we're gonna win anyway, so might as well save everyone that I can!"

thats not what i was saying. Theres no question that sovereign is the big threat. But what is the use of an Alliance that can't act, hanging about in space, waiting for a chance to attack something WELL beyond their reach at the time of their arrival, whilst simultaneously being attacked by a geth armada?
There is nothing the HAS to be stopped right now, possible of being stopped RIGHT now. Having a full strength 5th fleet doing nothing whilst they wait for Wards to open, THAT is completely illogical.
since they're going to be there anyway, why not have them perform a role. the saving of the Desiny Ascension takes moments. time enough for the wards to open, allowing the Alliance to then engage. 8 ships may be lost, but those 8 ships are cruisers whose combined strength is significantly less than even a damaged Asari Dreadnaught. the loss of those 8 ships is tragic, but necessary, IMHO. "protect the king" "sacrifice the pawns (although perhaps we could term them Knights)"

You may not think anything long-term isn't being considered. However, why should there not be?  Should the Alliance fail at taking out Sovereign, and there was no guarantee that all ships together, 8 more or less, would have stood any chance against Sovereign anyway. Having the most powerful ship in the Citadel Fleet (indeed within all Council Fleets) repairable, or even ready to rejoin the battle, is a major bonus.

[Spartas Husky]

Coz, if the reaper busted through the alliance fleet, I thought to myself....damn do I know how many citadel ships can I save? or that are still functional?.



Basically is military thinking. If you know the option is there to let your friends die....that means all they can do is buy you time, and not knowing how much damage the Arcturus fleet can inflict on Sovereign or how many geth ships would still be alive after they finish the council, is too risky to just buy time.



Honestly it was a matter of numbers....I did wanted the council gone.....but damn it was the council and their whole fleet...and a huge amount of unknowns, or save them, and have a couple dozen extra cruisers plus the Ascension's guns guarding the rear.



It would be awesome if due to you keep the collector base, I could personally kill the council....or at least the turian and salarian.....the salarian is just a politician, but the turian....just tries to damn hard to deny the reapers almost as if he is hiding something.

[CmdrFenix83]

devilsgrin wrote...

thats not what i was saying. Theres no question that sovereign is the big threat. But what is the use of an Alliance that can't act, hanging about in space, waiting for a chance to attack something WELL beyond their reach at the time of their arrival, whilst simultaneously being attacked by a geth armada?
There is nothing the HAS to be stopped right now, possible of being stopped RIGHT now. Having a full strength 5th fleet doing nothing whilst they wait for Wards to open, THAT is completely illogical.
since they're going to be there anyway, why not have them perform a role. the saving of the Desiny Ascension takes moments. time enough for the wards to open, allowing the Alliance to then engage. 8 ships may be lost, but those 8 ships are cruisers whose combined strength is significantly less than even a damaged Asari Dreadnaught. the loss of those 8 ships is tragic, but necessary, IMHO. "protect the king" "sacrifice the pawns (although perhaps we could term them Knights)"

You may not think anything long-term isn't being considered. However, why should there not be?  Should the Alliance fail at taking out Sovereign, and there was no guarantee that all ships together, 8 more or less, would have stood any chance against Sovereign anyway. Having the most powerful ship in the Citadel Fleet (indeed within all Council Fleets) repairable, or even ready to rejoin the battle, is a major bonus.

Irrelevant.  The entire decision is whether or not to sacrifice functional ships for one that is disabled.  Whether or not the ship can be repaired for later use is completely unimportant in the here and now.  You're looking into the mouth of oblivion here.  It's do or die against Sovereign.  This is the last stand moment, the Helm's Deep, the Battle of Yavin, the Battle of Endor, etc.  Fail here and the galaxy gets wiped out.  You can choose to throw ships away to save one that is tactically worthless in the here and now(fate of the galaxy hinges on *this* battle right now), or you can save every ship to give you that much more firepower against Sovereign. 

In game terms, there is no wrong choice.  Nothing will screw you over in the battle, and losing the Council has really bad consequences that annoy anyone that normally plays a Paragon without blindly taking every paragon choice.  In game terms, there zero difference between taking the pramatic route, and the douche route, which is annoying.

In story terms, you have zero info on the battle other than the fact that the Ascension is going down, Sovereign could win at any moment, and Sovereign's shields/weapon capabilties are completely unknown.  I'm not willing to take any chances here, so my main told the fleet to focus on Sovereign.

[RiouHotaru]

My biggest reason for saving the Council? Given that the Citadel was already having significant issues, even if a few human ships were lost, if Sovereign was THAT powerful, the few ships lost saving the DA wouldn't have mattered anyway.

[devilsgrin]

since I, as Shep, think longer-term than just here and now... i choose to save the Council and the Destiny Ascension, even as a Renegade. Theres too much to loose if the ship is lost, and too much to worry about if the Council goes. and lets not forget the rest of the Citadel Fleet as well... far more ships than the 8 Alliance ships lost. far more weapons to be used against Sovereign.

In military terms, contingency is crucial. There is no Grand Final battle. THIS is no grand final battle... which even Shep, with the info he/she has, knows. Its a delaying action. The entire Battle of the Citadel is an attempt to delay the Reapers from arriving. Keeping them from attacking by suprise, is of course, essential. But even the most Paragon Shep isn't so naive as to think this is the Last Stand that the Council/Citadel/Alliance will make against the Reapers.
the battle IS rather like the Battle of Helm's Deep, in a way, it prevents attack upon our civilization's core from another direction, and limits the enemy's line of attack (the prevention of allowing the Army of Saruman from also attacking Minas Tirith, and forcing the Armies of the Witch King to attack without re-inforcements). The Battle of Yavin is similar - in that its effect/mission is to remove a weapon from the enemy, the destruction of the enemy is not the mission, per se) The Battle of Endor, however, is the battle thats looming at the end of Mass Effect 3.

Modifié par devilsgrin, 24 mars 2010 - 09:28 .

[Wildecker]

CmdrFenix83 wrote...

Irrelevant.  The entire decision is whether or not to sacrifice functional ships for one that is disabled.  Whether or not the ship can be repaired for later use is completely unimportant in the here and now.  You're looking into the mouth of oblivion here.  It's do or die against Sovereign.  This is the last stand moment, the Helm's Deep, the Battle of Yavin, the Battle of Endor, etc.  Fail here and the galaxy gets wiped out.  You can choose to throw ships away to save one that is tactically worthless in the here and now(fate of the galaxy hinges on *this* battle right now), or you can save every ship to give you that much more firepower against Sovereign. 

In game terms, there is no wrong choice.  Nothing will screw you over in the battle, and losing the Council has really bad consequences that annoy anyone that normally plays a Paragon without blindly taking every paragon choice.  In game terms, there zero difference between taking the pramatic route, and the douche route, which is annoying.

In story terms, you have zero info on the battle other than the fact that the Ascension is going down, Sovereign could win at any moment, and Sovereign's shields/weapon capabilties are completely unknown.  I'm not willing to take any chances here, so my main told the fleet to focus on Sovereign.

Well. You know that Sovereign thinks it can be harmed, otherwise it would have shown up and opened the Citadel relay long ago.
You may even guess that the Destiny Ascendant is the only ship that really could harm Sovereign given that the entire Geth armada is hell bent on removing it it from the equation ASAP and distracted it from shooting at Sovereign before the CItadel had closed.
And you as Shepard know that with Saren down and Vigil's file running, Sovereign cannot call its reinforcements as planned. And wasn't it Saren's task to take out Citadel Control and manually route the controls through Sovereign to compensate for the Keeper's failure?
As far as you know, right then, the battle is over and Sovereign has to decide whether it will stay here and get shot at by Alliance reinforcements and whoever else may show up in the next minutes - or whether Sovereign will cut its losses and get away while it still can.

But that is not the point at all. You decided to let them die in your game, and that's okay for you. Now to tell me I was dumb/foolish/naive in my game because I decided to keep them around - that is not okay.

Modifié par Wildecker, 24 mars 2010 - 09:32 .

[CmdrFenix83]

devilsgrin wrote...

since I, as Shep, think longer-term than just here and now... i choose to save the Council and the Destiny Ascension, even as a Renegade. Theres too much to loose if the ship is lost, and too much to worry about if the Council goes.

In military terms, contingency is crucial. There is no Grand Final battle. THIS is no grand final battle... which even Shep, with the info he/she has, knows. Its a delaying action. The entire Battle of the Citadel is an attempt to delay the Reapers from arriving. Keeping them from attacking by suprise, is of course, essential. But even the most Paragon Shep isn't so naive as to think this is the Last Stand that the Council/Citadel/Alliance will make against the Reapers.

the battle IS rather like the Battle of Helm's Deep, in a way, it prevents attack upon our civilization's core from another direction, and limits the enemy's line of attack (the prevention of allowing the Army of Saruman from also attacking Minas Tirith, and forcing the Armies of the Witch King to attack without re-inforcements). The Battle of Yavin is similar - in that its effect/mission is to remove a weapon from the enemy, the destruction of the enemy is not the mission, per se) The Battle of Endor, however, is the battle thats looming at the end of Mass Effect 3.

This would be the most akin to the Battle fo Yavin.  Succeed or be wiped out entirely.  Failure is *not* an option.  This very much is a last stand moment.  If you fail right here and now, you lose it all.  You cannot hope to beat the Reaper fleet right now, and you must commit every resource possible to stopping them *now*. 

*If* you win, you can take time to prepare.  For all you know, the rest of that fleet is trapped in dark space without the Citadel Relay being activated.  We don't know what kinds of contingency plans they have, but you do know that you've bought yourself time with victory.  However, thoughts of victory are very premature.  You have to stop Sovereign first.  Again, how would you know that the ships lost saving the defunct Destiny Ascension weren't enough firepower to just barely tip the scales in the favor of victory?  There's no way of knowing, and with the fate of the galaxy on the line, *my* Shepard, wasn't taking any chances.  The fate of the galaxy is more important than one ship and three individuals.

[CmdrFenix83]

Wildecker wrote...

Well. You know that Sovereign thinks it can be harmed, otherwise it would have shown up and opened the Citadel relay long ago.
You may even guess that the Destiny Ascendant is the only ship that really could harm Sovereign given that the entire Geth armada is hell bent on removing it it from the equation ASAP and distracted it from shooting at Sovereign before the CItadel had closed.
And you as Shepard know that with Saren down and Vigil's file running, Sovereign cannot call its reinforcements as planned. And wasn't it Saren's task to take out Citadel Control and manually route the controls through Sovereign to compensate for the Keeper's failure?
As far as you know, right then, the battle is over and Sovereign has to decide whether it will stay here and get shot at by Alliance reinforcements and whoever else may show up in the next minutes - or whether Sovereign will cut its losses and get away while it still can.

But that is not the point at all. You decided to let them die in your game, and that's okay for you. Now to tell me I was dumb/foolish/naive in my game because I decided to keep them around - that is not okay.

Again, stop thinking that rescuing the Destiny Ascension will help you in this battle!  Their main drive is offline.  They're dead in space, they just haven't blown up.  If you save them, they're going to do nothing except survive.  They will not be joining the battle.

Saren's job was to bypass the Citadel's external defenses and take manual control of the station, then hand it over to Sovereign, yes.  However, if that was his entire job, there would be no point for the Geth in space.  Saren could have boarded the Citadel with an army of Geth and poured into the Control Center and just held that section of the Presidium until the Citadel was under his control, the Sovereign could send his signal from Ilos to open the Citadel Relay. 

Hacking does not require a hardwired connection in this galaxy.  We've seen this from everything via omnitools.  Sovereign would regain control of the Citadel at any moment.  Vigil tells you himself that his datafile is temporary.  Look how good EDI is at hacking, and she is made from part of Sovereign himself.  Imagine what the original could do?  Time is an issue in this battle.

Modifié par CmdrFenix83, 24 mars 2010 - 09:42 .

[devilsgrin]

CmdrFenix83 wrote...

devilsgrin wrote...

since I, as Shep, think longer-term than just here and now... i choose to save the Council and the Destiny Ascension, even as a Renegade. Theres too much to loose if the ship is lost, and too much to worry about if the Council goes.

In military terms, contingency is crucial. There is no Grand Final battle. THIS is no grand final battle... which even Shep, with the info he/she has, knows. Its a delaying action. The entire Battle of the Citadel is an attempt to delay the Reapers from arriving. Keeping them from attacking by suprise, is of course, essential. But even the most Paragon Shep isn't so naive as to think this is the Last Stand that the Council/Citadel/Alliance will make against the Reapers.

the battle IS rather like the Battle of Helm's Deep, in a way, it prevents attack upon our civilization's core from another direction, and limits the enemy's line of attack (the prevention of allowing the Army of Saruman from also attacking Minas Tirith, and forcing the Armies of the Witch King to attack without re-inforcements). The Battle of Yavin is similar - in that its effect/mission is to remove a weapon from the enemy, the destruction of the enemy is not the mission, per se) The Battle of Endor, however, is the battle thats looming at the end of Mass Effect 3.

This would be the most akin to the Battle fo Yavin.  Succeed or be wiped out entirely.  Failure is *not* an option.  This very much is a last stand moment.  If you fail right here and now, you lose it all.  You cannot hope to beat the Reaper fleet right now, and you must commit every resource possible to stopping them *now*. 

*If* you win, you can take time to prepare.  For all you know, the rest of that fleet is trapped in dark space without the Citadel Relay being activated.  We don't know what kinds of contingency plans they have, but you do know that you've bought yourself time with victory.  However, thoughts of victory are very premature.  You have to stop Sovereign first.  Again, how would you know that the ships lost saving the defunct Destiny Ascension weren't enough firepower to just barely tip the scales in the favor of victory?  There's no way of knowing, and with the fate of the galaxy on the line, *my* Shepard, wasn't taking any chances.  The fate of the galaxy is more important than one ship and three individuals.

its a last stand moment, perhaps, it is not however THE Last Stand. Last Stands usually fail. The Last stand would be the Reaper fleet converging upon the tattered remnants of the Allied Council Fleets in some random system, dramatically lets just say before the Citadel or Earth or Thessia...wherever suitably epic.

perhaps My Shep has more faith in the abilities of the Fleet she called home for so very long. She would also know the exact firepower available to a Cruiser would not be significant enough to tip scales one way or another... not against a Reaper. 8, yes, 8 might. Might is a huge word, and Might work, or WILL rescue the Destiny Ascension... i choose a certainty when all other hope is Might.

[Jax Sparrow]

MarkusWhatever wrote...

Jax Sparrow wrote...

Barquiel wrote...

• the asari councilor is hot <3

Q.4T.

and she still owes Shep a reward for saving her life...

*imagines the Asari Counsilor as apart of the Romance DLC*

As for the whole logic schtick really people, the point to saving the Destiny Ascension was because it was the noble thing to do.  The fact that the council is consistently an impediment to your mission is exactly what makes it such a noble/paragon act.  Pure logic and reason fails.

Modifié par Jax Sparrow, 24 mars 2010 - 10:00 .

[CmdrFenix83]

devilsgrin wrote...

its a last stand moment, perhaps, it is not however THE Last Stand. Last Stands usually fail. The Last stand would be the Reaper fleet converging upon the tattered remnants of the Allied Council Fleets in some random system, dramatically lets just say before the Citadel or Earth or Thessia...wherever suitably epic.

perhaps My Shep has more faith in the abilities of the Fleet she called home for so very long. She would also know the exact firepower available to a Cruiser would not be significant enough to tip scales one way or another... not against a Reaper. 8, yes, 8 might. Might is a huge word, and Might work, or WILL rescue the Destiny Ascension... i choose a certainty when all other hope is Might.

I didn't say it was *the* last stand, I said it was a moment like that.  If you fail, then yeah, it was your last stand.  The rest of the Citadel and Alliance fleets spread throughout the galaxy would be utterly devastated by the Reaper fleet, even more so since the Reapers can turn off the relay network fromt he Citadel, isolating all of those ships to be picked off at their leisure.

Again, you can have all the faith in the galaxy, it doesn't give you any more knowledge of Sovereign's capabilities.  It sounds more like you severely underestimated him.  This ship is billions of years old and has been doing this for eons.  What makes you think your little Arcturus fleet's victory is so assured that you can throw away several cruisers saving a defunct vessel?

And saving the Ascension wasn't a certainty.  Joker tells you that they can save it, but that didnt' make it a guarantee.  Hell, if you want to go down that road, the two squadmates tell you that the Council *must* be sacrificed for the greater good.  You've got just as much certainty following their word as you do his. 

Point is, my Shepard wasn't going to take any chances throwing away ships to save a single, disabled vessel when the fate of the galaxy was at stake.  Without knowing what Sovereign was capable of, he deemed that every single vessel might be required to win, and made the decision to sacrifice the tactically useless ship for the greater good.

[CmdrFenix83]

Jax Sparrow wrote...

MarkusWhatever wrote...

Jax Sparrow wrote...

Barquiel wrote...

• the asari councilor is hot <3

Q.4T.

and she still owes Shep a reward for saving her life...

*imagines the Asari Counsilor as apart of the Romance DLC*

As for the whole logic schtick really people, the point to saving the Destiny Ascension was because it was the noble thing to do.  The Destiny Ascension had more lives onboard than probably the entire Fifth Fleet as a whole.  But, the fact that the council is consistently an impediment to your mission is exactly what makes it such a noble/paragon act.  Pure logic and reason fails.

That's not even remotely true.  The Destiny Ascension had a crew of 10,000.  The 8 cruisers lost saving that thing alone had crews of 800 each, they lost 6400 people to save 10,000, then still had the ships left to engage Sovereign in that final battle where they lost many, many more ships.  If even 4 more ships had been lost saving the Ascension, it would have been hitting the point of breaking even, any more would have been a net loss of life.

[Jax Sparrow]

CmdrFenix83 So I was wrong on the numbers; And yet, you missed the part where I said logic and reason fail... Logic and Reason are the Renegade schtick...

[CmdrFenix83]

Jax Sparrow wrote...

CmdrFenix83 So I was wrong on the numbers; And yet, you missed the part where I said logic and reason fail... Logic and Reason are the Renegade schtick...

I don't think anyone argued against the type of points rewarded or the morality of the decision.  Some people make decisions based on what they think is the right answer for their character, and not "Oh, this one is blue/on the top, it must be the right one!"

Logic doesn't fail.  In fact, you've just supported my point that it's more *logical* to let the Council die.  I've said at least a few times in this thread that this situation is one where idealism and morality get set aside to do what must be done.  If 3 have to die, so that millions can live, so be it(X57).  If 10,000 have to die so that *trillions* can live, then so be it.