10 réponses à ce sujet

[magimix 2000]

Bioware demonstrated tremendous strength of vision when it came to their willingness to modify game-mechanics that had been used in ME1.  Such significant changes, I'm sure, entailed much agonising, discussion, and review, and such changes as were made were all done so for very specific reasons.

Assuming that during the design process for ME2 it was all 'up for grabs', I'd imagine those aspects that carried over into ME2 were *kept* for specific reasons also, with as much agonising, debate, and review that went into the things that got changed.

With that that in mind, why carry over the concept of skill pre-requisites (where the availability of a skill is dependant on first investing enough points into different one)?  What value does it add to the game?  I tried some searching, but didn't get back anything that covered this particular topic. 

If anyone can point me to an 'official' source that might elaborate on this, that'd be great.  Beyond that, what do other people think about having pre-requisites?  For example, did having to stick 3 points into Cryo Blast to 'unlock' AI Hack give you a warm feeling inside?

(In case it wasn't obvious, I disliked skill pre-requisites in ME1, and I was genuinely surprised when the concept was kept for ME2 )

[Doctor_Jackstraw]

it keeps skill distrobution points balanced.

[Sabresandiego]

I dont like skill pre-reqs either, but I am guessing that the logic behind them is to force you to use multiple abilities rather than min max.

[magimix 2000]

That also makes it harder to create well differentiated builds of a given class. When I do, for example, another Engineer playthrough, I want to mix things up and make that Engineer different from the others in a way that'll have a meaningful impact on gameplay.



More generally, in the 7 playthroughs I've done so far (with number 8 on the go), I try to evolve 5 talents and, in essence, neglect 2. Since Shepard can have 7 talents in total (when including the bonus talent), different builds within a given class emphasise (and evolve) different aspects, and thus alter the gameplay in interesting ways.



I don't see 'balanced distribution of points' as an inherently good thing. When I want to try a 'balanced' or generalised build, I'll build it. If I want to try a strongly focused build, I ought to be able to do that too, in all cases.

[phordicus]

there's no good reason for it. it's an artifact of RPGs.

[The Spamming Troll part 2]

pre reqs are bad. it doesnt make any sense at all. if anything it handcuffs your imagination for different builds of the same class. this entire forum should be a great indication of what bioware did wrong with classes, as in theres no discusion of what vangaurd build is the best. the ME1 forums were filled with nemesis vangaurds VS shock trooper vangaurds and so on. now the only topics are "look how fast i can beat the game with a vangaurd"



anyways, prereqs should be removed. i dont know why a developer that breaks the mold like bioware, would be stuck with us still having to deal with pointless prereqs. the best thing would be letting us create our own class. sortof like fallout3.

[Spartas Husky]

Is not bad to have reqs...but in this game they made it absolutely pointless. If you increase a biotic power it must lead to another biotic power that after training you get to use.



Much like you learn to ride a bicycle before you learn to ride motor bike.



But WHat does incendiary ammo, has to do with pull?, or concussion shot have to do with incendiary ammo?, what does overload have to do with warp....etc.



If reqs are going to be use they have to be used when in relation to the skill that lead to it.

[chikndip]

you could try the infinite skill point glitch and then neglect to use the abilities you don't want..

[kinsha22]

I'm guessing they included because they wanted some semblance of "unlocking" and also to force pay more for certain skills. This would give the illusion of multiple ways to build a character. Personally I think for next game they need to make the basic class expertise skill a core skill to level and changing from a shock trooper or a commando would unlock a new skill tree. IE: shock trooper would unlock charge or something and commando would unlock maybe.... concussive blast. you get the idea. One playthrough wouldn't allow you to have both on a single skills on a single char.

[magimix 2000]

kinsha22 wrote...

I'm guessing they included because they wanted some semblance of "unlocking" and also to force pay more for certain skills. This would give the illusion of multiple ways to build a character. Personally I think for next game they need to make the basic class expertise skill a core skill to level and changing from a shock trooper or a commando would unlock a new skill tree. IE: shock trooper would unlock charge or something and commando would unlock maybe.... concussive blast. you get the idea. One playthrough wouldn't allow you to have both on a single skills on a single char.

I don't see that as at all better, to be honest.  The fact that you can't legitimately max out all available talents is already a viable (and reasonable, in my opinion) way of encouraging variety within builds.  I don't see that tiered skill-trees ala Dragon Age are a good fit for Mass Effect.

I like how levelling and talent progression works in Mass Effect; its a good fit in terms of where they wanted to take the gameplay, and works well.  But as someone mentioned above, pre-reqs feel like a holdover - something you'd have expected to get jettisoned along with other traditional holdovers that weren't a good fit (XP from kills, orthodox loot and inventory, skill-centric weapon accuracy).

Modifié par magimix 2000, 25 mars 2010 - 07:53 .

[Spartas Husky]

chikndip wrote...

you could try the infinite skill point glitch and then neglect to use the abilities you don't want..

Which is what I did, since I found out about it just recently. But what if that glitched wasn't there.???