284 réponses à ce sujet

[Mcjon01]

CmdrFenix83 wrote...

Collider wrote...

Honestly, I don't even know the reasoning for this whole discussion. There is NO reason to write Tali as being bisexual yet not have her romance open to females. There are already lesbian romances in the game, Tali would have been no different. How about this folks? Consider this: she's straight and not into chicks. Problem solved. You'll be sorely disappointed if you think that any romanceable character will magically be open to the same sex in ME3 when they haven't beforehand

Agreed.  If they wanted to include new romancable characters, any of them could be gay/straight/bi, but the character currently presented all are what they are.

So very much this.

[CmdrFenix83]

JohnnyDollar wrote...

WarChicken78 wrote...

Not that I'd have a problem with lesbian scenes (which guy has?), but Tali and Femshep?

Not all straight guys drool over F/F.

Truth.  I find it to be rather boring myself.  Never-ending foreplay.

[Lemonwizard]

Tali not even vaguely hinting at attraction in the slightest in ME1 then being all over you in ME2 was already a pretty huge cop out for the sake of fanservice. Not only that, but the reasoning for it of "I had feelings for you but because our relationship wouldn't be considered normal by societal standards (the human/quarian thing), I figured you wouldn't feel the same way so I never said anything" is pretty much the ONLY real justification for why she wouldn't have said anything to a Femshep in ME2.




Taking that exact same reason and using it over again and just replacing interspecies with homosexual....well, I really don't see how it could come off as anything other than contrived and done purely for the sake of fanservice. It was bad enough once, doing it a second time (on the same character, no less) would be nothing short of silly.

[SkywardDescent]

I am fine with there being a  homosexual romance, but do we really need every character to be gay?

Modifié par SkywardDescent, 25 mars 2010 - 11:53 .

[InvaderErl]

Just to point something out, there's nothing wrong with fan service as long as it doesn't undermine the work nor is there a problem with the character's developing feelings for each other. Bioware as far as I am concerned covered their ass in that regard and it doesn't lessen the great relationship Shep and Tali have in 2.

Hell, Han Solo showed no real attraction to Leia outside of faking one to poke fun at Luke (blah) and in ESB he's all of a sudden seriously in love with her and the same goes for Leia. It was fanservice, but it worked and I think the same holds true for Tali.

Modifié par InvaderErl, 25 mars 2010 - 11:56 .

[Lemonwizard]

InvaderErl wrote...

Just to point something out, there's nothing wrong with fan service as long as it doesn't undermine the work nor is there a problem with the character's developing feelings for each other. Bioware as far as I am concerned covered their ass in that regard and it doesn't lessen the great relationship Shep and Tali have in 2.

Hell, Han Solo showed no real attraction to Leia outside of faking one to poke fun at Luke (blah) and in ESB he's all of a sudden seriously in love with her and the same goes for Leia. It was fanservice, but it worked and I think the same holds true for Tali.

I understand that, and I think they pulled it off reasonably well also. I'm just saying that when the same character gives basically the same speech again.....it would take some pretty incredible writing to make it come off as anything but dumb.

[InvaderErl]

Shandepared wrote...

Are you kidding? Han had a thing for her from almost the first moment they met.

Example please, I've seen the movie quite a few times and he is very icy towards her, save for one moment where he admires that she's got spirit.

Shandepared wrote... If anything came out of the blue it was the whole brother-sister thing. I wonder if they ever think back to that steamy kiss and blush.

Agreed but Leia in ANH was clearly written as Luke's girl.

[Mev186]

I say Bioware should make a Romance pack and let people romance whomever they want. I don't really buy the whole "You can't change her character" excuse. Who says She would act differently ? Why can't She be the same nerdy, Tech girl and still be bisexual. But that's just my two cents. At this point, I'd be happy if my Femshep could romance Jack *Shutters*

[Vaenier]

No one has given a valid argument why Tali should not be bi. The one that came close, "Because they would take time away from other parts of the game," fails because the work is already there. They have the dialogue, the animations, the plan all laid out. But for some inconceivable reason, they did not finish.

[ObserverStatus]

I play as man-shep so I don't care either way.

[Tooneyman]

I say keep tali straight, she doesn't seem like the lezzy type no offense and hate all you want. I like my liara femshep. Leave tali alone. If you want a lezzy quarian how about the one you helped on the citadel. hehe.

[Lemonwizard]

Vaenier wrote...

No one has given a valid argument why Tali should not be bi. The one that came close, "Because they would take time away from other parts of the game," fails because the work is already there. They have the dialogue, the animations, the plan all laid out. But for some inconceivable reason, they did not finish.

The valid argument is because she's not bisexual now. This isn't something people just decide on willy-nilly, it's a very important aspect of a person that can be defining in somebody's life. You don't just decide to be bisexual or not, it doesn't work that way.



At the people who contend that some of the dialogue that was recorded but not used proves she is now, I'd like to point out that the original script of Mass Effect 2 had Legion recovering Shepard's body and the Geth rebuilding him. However, that was tabled. We don't know why, we don't know if it would have been better the other way, but the developers made a decision and as soon as the game shipped without that content, it became part of the real story. This is no different.




And at all the people who use Tali's suit linking conversation about evidence, I'd like to point out that Tali is not at all unique in being a love interest who has the "romance subplot starts here" conversation with the same gender but the player is just not given the appropriate response. That's not evidence that she has a crush on Femshep, it's evidence that the developers were lazy and didn't bother to write alternate dialogue for ANY of the love interests.

[XX55XX]

Is it really necessary for every character to be gay? Honestly...

I hope Tali remains straight, thank you very much.

[Vaenier]

Lemonwizard wrote...

Vaenier wrote...

No one has given a valid argument why Tali should not be bi. The one that came close, "Because they would take time away from other parts of the game," fails because the work is already there. They have the dialogue, the animations, the plan all laid out. But for some inconceivable reason, they did not finish.

The valid argument is because she's not bisexual now. This isn't something people just decide on willy-nilly, it's a very important aspect of a person that can be defining in somebody's life. You don't just decide to be bisexual or not, it doesn't work that way.

Being non bisexual is not something people just decide on willynilly, etc... That goes both ways, to lazy to rewrite your entire paragraph in an attempt to be an ass

And at all the people who use Tali's suit linking conversation about evidence, I'd like to point out that Tali is not at all unique in being a love interest who has the "romance subplot starts here" conversation with the same gender but the player is just not given the appropriate response. That's not evidence that she has a crush on Femshep, it's evidence that the developers were lazy and didn't bother to write alternate dialogue for ANY of the love interests.

Yes.

At the people who contend that some of the dialogue that was recorded
but not used proves she is now, I'd like to point out that the original
script of Mass Effect 2 had Legion recovering Shepard's body and the
Geth rebuilding him.

More proof that their original ideas were much better then what the final product contained... What the hell happened to BioWare? They seem to be ruining their awsome games...

[Lemonwizard]

Personally I'd much rather work with the Geth than with the Illusive Man so I'd prefer it that way, but that's not what the developers decided to do with ME2 in the end so I see nothing productive in complaining about it.

[Andrew_Waltfeld]

Lemonwizard wrote...

Personally I'd much rather work with the Geth than with the Illusive Man so I'd prefer it that way, but that's not what the developers decided to do with ME2 in the end so I see nothing productive in complaining about it.

True enough, Geth ftw. Would have been epic, and to be honest, it probably would have been interesting seeing the entire "baby" culture of the geth.


minor editing was done.

Modifié par Andrew_Waltfeld, 26 mars 2010 - 01:24 .

[InvaderErl]

Shandepared wrote...

InvaderErl wrote...

Example please, I've seen the movie quite a few times and he is very icy towards her, save for one moment where he admires that she's got spirit.

"So, kid, you think a princess and a guy like me-"

Luke, "No."

Except he was teasing Luke.

Watch the scene, Luke asks what Han thinks of her, he says he's trying not to, Luke says "good", Han notices says that line and Luke says no which makes Han laugh.

[Goodwood]

Andrew_Waltfeld wrote...

Lemonwizard wrote...

Personally I'd much rather work with the Geth than with the Illusive Man so I'd prefer it that way, but that's not what the developers decided to do with ME2 in the end so I see nothing productive in complaining about it.

True enough, Geth ftw. Would have been epic, and to be honest, it probably would have been interesting seeing the entire "baby" culture of the geth.


minor editing was done.

Original ideas for story plots seldom play out unaltered; as cool as it would have been to have had the geth rebuild Shepard, it would be difficult to make that fit for the entire course of the game. ME2's storyline had to explain the difference between the "heretics" and the original geth, since there had been no clear difference betore, while Cerberus was already a known quantity within the MEverse.

Remember, the original script for the first Star Wars film was completely rewritten no fewer than four times, with early drafts including such differences as all Rebel and Imperial soldiers using lightsabers, and the Force being channeled through a type of crystal.

[Sherana]

Is there a phrase for an argument where both sides twist truth to fit their preconceptions and the majority couldn't care less?



I mean, besides "the Internet".

[Homebound]

If Tali became a Femshep LI, she'd be a stereotype. I do not support this.

[Jake71887]

Personally, I have no desire to romance Tali with my Femshep; but I think the option should be there for the gals who love her as much as us!  

Modifié par Jake71887, 26 mars 2010 - 01:40 .