155 réponses à ce sujet

[AngryFrozenWater]

Rixxencaxx wrote...

Well..in the end...
when dao came out lovers/haters ratio was 10-1
since awakening came out lovers/haters ratio was 2-10
this ratio is similar in all gamers forums (not only bioware's)
I think that bioware lost a lot of customers.
Since bioware became another cheap developer we can look only to blizzard and to the really promising witcher 2
eastern european companies are developing really great original games nowadays...
a lot of western companies are into the cut cost just go china syndrome...
just my opinion...

I agree with you. And like you I am watching the smaller companies more closely.

[Daemond1]

I think that a lot of people are judging this expansion against the main game (and even perhaps having their opinions tarnished already by previous Bioware expansions; not least of all the original Mass Effect expansion ie. Bring Down the Sky, etc. which were not great value for money.  Or actually even that great, at all... ) which I think is completely unfair.  As a standalone game, it easily packs in more content and value than the majority of other single-player games.  There are areas of it which could definitely have been improved, not least of all the ending, which I thought was awful and didn't even stand up to some of the other boss battles throughout the game.  I'm convinced that if there had been more time spent on it then it would have been much better received. 

I also felt that in bringing over only Oghren (who, in my opinion, was one of the weakest characters from that game) from the original game, the continuation didn't feel real enough.

Also, just played through the City Elf origin story.  I thought that that was particularly weak but the human mage is shaping up to be pretty interesting.

Anyway... I would put myself slightly more on the 'lovers' side.

DD1

Modifié par Daemond1, 29 mars 2010 - 03:12 .

[Feraele]

Awakening is NOT a standalone, it is listed as an expansion...hehehe

[Imban]

I don't think there's anyone in my gaming community - which has about 40 members - that liked Origins but really disliked Awakening. General consensus seems to be that it was fun, but not one of the better expansions out there - for Bioware's own work, Throne of Bhaal, Shadows of Undrentide, and Hordes of the Underdark were all better. (As was NWN2's Mask of the Betrayer, though decidedly not Storm of Zehir. )



Really, the primary objections in my group seem to be the bugs, the lack of difficulty, and (from the parts that played it on PC rather than X360) the breaking mods and not having a toolset update ready to go to help people fix their mods.



I was also sad that there's no Epilogue Save for Awakening, too, since the Origins one is quite useful for mods.

[T1l]

It's the bugs, continuity and difficulty that fail to keep me entertained in Awakening. I'm actually finding it difficult to keep myself motivated to play it, which really surprises me considering how much I enjoyed Origins. It's not bad per se, it's just not great, either.

It was just a quality issue. The level of polish just wasn't there this time. The strongest part of the game were the characters, but even the characters felt rushed and there was little interaction (Sigrun was a particular favourite, but her quest bugged on me and I was unable to see her character develop). I'll wait for official patches and community mods to address these issues before attempting to play though Awakening again.

[Layn]

Imban wrote...

Really, the primary objections in my group seem to be the bugs, the lack of difficulty, and (from the parts that played it on PC rather than X360) the breaking mods and not having a toolset update ready to go to help people fix their mods.

to me it was (from most important to least important): hardly immersive, bad continuity, low difficulty, bugs (mostly crashes).

breaking mods was only slightly annoying. i'd wish helm removal would work again, but i can live without it. and thank god for the mod that transfers DLC items. sure they eventually become pretty weak, but it just adds to continuity.

Modifié par Crrash, 29 mars 2010 - 05:14 .

[sami jo]

David Gaider wrote...

sami jo wrote...
And really, it isn't all that clear that the opinions of the vocal few who frequent this site aren't the opinions of the silent masses who do not.  They are, after all, apathetic enough to remain silent.

Well, first off: whoa.

Lest what I wrote be taken as a personal assault on you, it wasn't intended as such.  Obviously, I love both your writing and this game.  I have owned and enjoyed every game Bioware has ever produced except ME2, and that is primarily because I am still too busy playing DA:O.  It is just frustrating to see the quality of the games suffering.

Edit: And for the record, I really do appreciate your presence on the forums.

Modifié par sami jo, 29 mars 2010 - 07:59 .

[Rixxencaxx]

Realmzmaster wrote...

Rixxencaxx wrote...

Realmzmaster wrote...

Rixxencaxx wrote...

Timurlane wrote...


Blizzard does make fantastic games, yes. But Blizzard does not deviate whatsoever from the middle road biggest market projects which is why they will never release a party-based multi-character RPG. The fact is most people don't like them and just want to control their PC a la diablo style. If this genre is not for you, don't play them, BioWare will survive plenty well off their base market so long as they continue to create the same environments with the same immersive characters and "deep" (relative to the rest of the industry) plot and character development.
As to the BioWare losing "a lot of customers" (presumably not just yourself), my guess is these are the same customers they lost when RtO was repeatedly delayed and I'm doubting they felt the sting too badly with their DA:A sales.

Blizzard was mentioned as an example....cause they care a lot about customers.
Starcraft 1 after 10 years receive patches....
If a game is not perfect they don't sell it.
Blizzard is a model.
This is not a matter of genre...is a matter of quality.....i like old school rpg....don't like cheap quality...

Starcraft 1 had bugs after it shipped otherwise there would be no need for patches. Starcraft 1 was not perfect and they did sell it. There were several patches.
Blizzard is a good company with good service, but not necessarily a model.

starcraft 1 had no bugs..patches were all about balance and new maps...
starcraft 2 is in beta and testers found rarely a bug....
however you missed my point...i loved the original dragon age.....the vanilla version i mean without patches...
the patches resolved no bugs and simply made the game easier.
I don't like the new direction taken by this game.

What are you talking about? Starcraft 1 and 2 had game stopping bugs and  lots of exploits. Some bugs still exist even though the game has been patched to version 1.16.1. No the patches were not all about balance and new maps. Yes, I read the bug report fix that came with each patch.
The Dragon Age patches did fix loading time and several other bugs. It changes only the easy mode to make it easier. It did not change the other modes.  Yes, I read the bug report fix that comes with each patch to see what balance changes, gameplay fixes and bugs were squashed.

NO...YOU DON'T READ


Dragon Age: Origins v1.01a Patch Notes

• Fixed potential corruption of character statistics
• Fixed portrait appearance sliders when importing a character
  from the downloadable
• Character Creator Fixed import for preset face settings from the
  downloadable
• Character Creator Made Easy difficulty easier
• Slightly increased attack, defense, and damage scores for all
  party members at Normal difficulty
• Fixed video issues when running on a very wide screen display,
  including ATI Eyefinity displays

were slightly means...god mode on

Modifié par Rixxencaxx, 29 mars 2010 - 09:14 .

[Demx]

Rixxencaxx wrote...

NO...YOU DON'T READ


Dragon Age: Origins v1.01a Patch Notes

• Fixed potential corruption of character statistics
• Fixed portrait appearance sliders when importing a character
  from the downloadable
• Character Creator Fixed import for preset face settings from the
  downloadable
• Character Creator Made Easy difficulty easier
• Slightly increased attack, defense, and damage scores for all
  party members at Normal difficulty
• Fixed video issues when running on a very wide screen display,
  including ATI Eyefinity displays

were slightly means...god mode on

When this patch came out, was it also the start of people posting their solo gameplays?

[JaegerBane]

Imban wrote...

I don't think there's anyone in my gaming community - which has about 40 members - that liked Origins but really disliked Awakening. General consensus seems to be that it was fun, but not one of the better expansions out there - for Bioware's own work, Throne of Bhaal, Shadows of Undrentide, and Hordes of the Underdark were all better. (As was NWN2's Mask of the Betrayer, though decidedly not Storm of Zehir. )

Really, the primary objections in my group seem to be the bugs, the lack of difficulty, and (from the parts that played it on PC rather than X360) the breaking mods and not having a toolset update ready to go to help people fix their mods.

I was also sad that there's no Epilogue Save for Awakening, too, since the Origins one is quite useful for mods.

Agreed. Ultimately the majority of the complaints about Awakening appear to be annoyances about bugs and nitpicking about lore and whatnot. Very few of the loonies who screaming that awakening is the worstest gamez of ALL TIME!!!111oneone aren't really being realistic.

[Realmzmaster]

Rixxencaxx wrote...

Realmzmaster wrote...

Rixxencaxx wrote...

Realmzmaster wrote...

Rixxencaxx wrote...

Timurlane wrote...


Blizzard does make fantastic games, yes. But Blizzard does not deviate whatsoever from the middle road biggest market projects which is why they will never release a party-based multi-character RPG. The fact is most people don't like them and just want to control their PC a la diablo style. If this genre is not for you, don't play them, BioWare will survive plenty well off their base market so long as they continue to create the same environments with the same immersive characters and "deep" (relative to the rest of the industry) plot and character development.
As to the BioWare losing "a lot of customers" (presumably not just yourself), my guess is these are the same customers they lost when RtO was repeatedly delayed and I'm doubting they felt the sting too badly with their DA:A sales.

Blizzard was mentioned as an example....cause they care a lot about customers.
Starcraft 1 after 10 years receive patches....
If a game is not perfect they don't sell it.
Blizzard is a model.
This is not a matter of genre...is a matter of quality.....i like old school rpg....don't like cheap quality...

Starcraft 1 had bugs after it shipped otherwise there would be no need for patches. Starcraft 1 was not perfect and they did sell it. There were several patches.
Blizzard is a good company with good service, but not necessarily a model.

starcraft 1 had no bugs..patches were all about balance and new maps...
starcraft 2 is in beta and testers found rarely a bug....
however you missed my point...i loved the original dragon age.....the vanilla version i mean without patches...
the patches resolved no bugs and simply made the game easier.
I don't like the new direction taken by this game.

What are you talking about? Starcraft 1 and 2 had game stopping bugs and  lots of exploits. Some bugs still exist even though the game has been patched to version 1.16.1. No the patches were not all about balance and new maps. Yes, I read the bug report fix that came with each patch.
The Dragon Age patches did fix loading time and several other bugs. It changes only the easy mode to make it easier. It did not change the other modes.  Yes, I read the bug report fix that comes with each patch to see what balance changes, gameplay fixes and bugs were squashed.

NO...YOU DON'T READ


Dragon Age: Origins v1.01a Patch Notes

• Fixed potential corruption of character statistics
  
  
• Fixed portrait appearance sliders when importing a character
  from the downloadable
  
  
• Character Creator Fixed import for preset face settings from the
  downloadable
  
  
• Character Creator Made Easy difficulty easier
  
  
• Slightly increased attack, defense, and damage scores for all
  party members at Normal difficulty
  
  
• Fixed video issues when running on a very wide screen display,
  including ATI Eyefinity displays

were slightly means...god mode on

Yes I do read.Let me define the word slightly to you. Slightly means to a small degree, hardly noticable. If you played the easy mode of Dragon Age before the patch you would have notice a dramatic difference in easy after the patch.You cannot detect a dramatic shift in normal. In fact the shift if you can find one is minute. Yes. I read slightly and knew exactly what it meant.

[*]No discernable difference. A difference that makes no difference is no difference. So unless you can show me the big difference I can only assume there is none.
[*]Also I believe you stated that Blizzard released Starcraft 1 with few bugs. But there are 16 major bug patches and one minor bug patch to date for the game, not just new maps and balancing gameplay. Yes, I read very well.

Modifié par Realmzmaster, 29 mars 2010 - 11:10 .

[Gloomhart]

Drake Sigar wrote...

So because an expansion isn't very good (in your opinion), Bioware have become another cheap developer? Cover your eyes people, I don't want you to see this.

How dare you. I wouldn't trust you to give me the correct change at your McDonalds job, let alone provide an informed opinion. Bioware take a huge chance and create a game which by all rights in today's gaming climate, shouldn't exist. They should be pandering solely to the casual masses, but instead they take a leap, show some balls, and release Dragon Age. It was a huge throwback to the old school RPG crowd, a crowd which is only a small minority. One of the first general comments in the magazines was it's "too hard." Not to mention an RPG is the most expensive type of game one can make. So here is Bioware, with their homage to the fans that put them where they are today, and you sully their name with these ridiculous claims because you didn't like one expansion?

Yes I'm sure you'll get plenty of immersion, interesting characters and story from World of Warcraft and Diablo 3.

/Thread

[Velvetmeds]

even though awakening was a bit disappointing, i still liked it and i still love the franchise.

[smudgedhorizon]

Sales figures do not show customer satisfaction.

I bought it, a number of my friends bought it - all of us admit to being massively disappointed. From others I have spoken to, we are far from the minority.



Current sales may be good, but a long term effect will manifest. People once bought anything with the Bioware name on it, based solely on the strength of your works' quality; now more and more people are losing that trust, that confidence, and will instead wait to buy Bioware titles, if they buy at all.

[yopen71]

DA:O - 9/10 the best game which I ever played
DA:A - 6/10 shame for those great developers or maybe time for buisness BioWare

I'm from Bulgaria.In our community have 200 - 300 members, that think like me
Sorry for my bad english!

Modifié par yopen71, 30 mars 2010 - 01:04 .

[0ts0]

DA:O = One of the best crpg ever made! Great game!

DA:A = hack-n-slash oriented Beta w limited options and sloppy fixes. Cannot touch it with a ten feet pole! Fix the game - it has the potential to become something good. I hope some community members (or Bioware themselves) fix this game - I lack proper skills to improve the expansion so.

[yopen71]

delete

Modifié par yopen71, 30 mars 2010 - 01:10 .

[Wolfaura]

I love DA:O



Haven't played DA:A Feel too iffy about it especially since most stores are selling it for $48 Aus

the cheapest I've seen it for online stores is around $40 Aus.



My instinct and experience says when I feel doubtful and not excited, save my money for something better. As I've known before I ignored how I felt and bought a game out of loyalty for that company and wished I never bought it.



I just hope that if they make a DA2 it will be as good as DA:O

[TheBearMage]

Awakening had let lots of us down no doubt. I've bought and beta every Bioware game since Baldur's Gate.... been waiting for Dragon Age for years since before Mass Effect even was close to being announced, used to come on to the forums everyday but I have been disappointed by every game since KOTOR (except sonic). Even Dragon Age, although I did love it, let me down on so many levels, not presentation wise but gameplay wise.



And with all this negativity surrounding Awakening, which by judgment far surpasses that found with Origins when it came out. So for the first time in over ten years I won't be purchasing a Bioware title. (except sonic)

[sarx8172]

Feraele wrote...

Awakening is NOT a standalone, it is listed as an expansion...hehehe

This.

Awakening was everything I thought it would be. I was disappointed by the lack of romance, but honestly, after numerous playthroughs, I can see why. I felt that Awakening was there for the pure action, scenes where you're thrown into massive battle after masive battle. And it was fun.

My character's love interest was mentioned in the epilogue, and that was good enough for me.

The only thing I disliked was the price tag. I was fortunate enough to encounter almost none of the bugs that everyone is crying and screaming about, save ones that I was able to resolve rather easily (invisible wall bug in particular). Bioware hasn't lost my support for yet.

Modifié par sarx8172, 30 mars 2010 - 03:14 .

[WilliamShatner]

If you aim low you will always hit low.

You have more of a chance of hitting high if you aim high.  www.vgchartz.com/games/index.php

[JaegerBane]

Gloomhart wrote...

Drake Sigar wrote...

So because an expansion isn't very good (in your opinion), Bioware have become another cheap developer? Cover your eyes people, I don't want you to see this.

How dare you. I wouldn't trust you to give me the correct change at your McDonalds job, let alone provide an informed opinion. Bioware take a huge chance and create a game which by all rights in today's gaming climate, shouldn't exist. They should be pandering solely to the casual masses, but instead they take a leap, show some balls, and release Dragon Age. It was a huge throwback to the old school RPG crowd, a crowd which is only a small minority. One of the first general comments in the magazines was it's "too hard." Not to mention an RPG is the most expensive type of game one can make. So here is Bioware, with their homage to the fans that put them where they are today, and you sully their name with these ridiculous claims because you didn't like one expansion?

Yes I'm sure you'll get plenty of immersion, interesting characters and story from World of Warcraft and Diablo 3.

/Thread

I'm inclined to agree.

I've got nowt but sympathy for those people who are having to deal with bugs and botched imports, but some of the self-important diatribes on here sound like they've come straight from some evangelist's pulpit.

'People have lost trust and confidence in the bioware name, mark my words, the effects will manifest and they will reap what they sow' blah blah blah. Geez, it's like listening to Kane from Command and Conquer. It's rhetoric.

This idea that they didn't like one expansion and therefore *everyone* now hates Bioware sits somewhere between arrogance and dementia. If I set bugs to one side, the worst I can say about Awakening is that it isn't as good as Mask of the Betrayer. It's an interesting expansion and I feel that is reflected in the scores (by most marking standards, 75% is generally well above average). Ultimately the only true vitriol I hear about this game is on these forums, the same place I heard the only true vitriol I came across for ME2, ME1, and DA:O.

[Sinferno]

Blizzard is a good company with good service, but not necessarily a model.

Blizzard not necessarily a model?

One of the reasons Blizzard's a top developer is because they refine and focus on Gameplay first. Their old games and their new games are one of the most balanced games ever created. Starcraft is a sport in Korea, MLG World of Warcraft and Warcraft 3 Tournaments and a large amount of players are still playing Diablo2. Blizzard creates games for casual and hardcore players. Blizzard produce games when they feel the game is ready not their producers Activision. Blizzard creates high qaulity games because they listen to their forums (which helps balance & bugs) , focus on gameplay, and they take whatever time they feel is nessessary. Facts. 

 Developers would be wise to take a hint or two from them. They are wealthy enough to come out with their own Battle.net system, a social tight knit community program that keeps track of the players friends, games, and more. Is it because they made their games available on multiple platforms? No, its because they make (a) qaulity game(s) and proceed from there. They don't make a bad casual game, hype it up, and try to get a short lived currency like the majority of developers these days. Best of luck on SWTOR, Bioware!

Comparing Blizzard to any other developers today is like comparing a Habinaro chile to a Ghost pepper in my opinion. Developers would be wise to take a hint or two from them.

Valve, Blizzard, and Bioware have been my favorite developers because they've been making qaulity games since 1998+ and they continue to do so. I personally am sick of this "casual era" we are currently in and games that do not have a proper functioning difficulty shows that the developers do not care about the hardcore player or the player that wishes to master the developers game at a higher ability. Dragon age was a great story and experience, but to have a difficulty option that is not propery balanced is rediculous nowadays. This shown me that Bioware didn't care much for their gameplay mechanics, and their crowded interface and crafting functions is evidence enough. Can we please move into the future or atleast the present?
 

Lets cater some(or atleast give a proper functioning option) to the devoted players who takes their time to acually learn to play the game, not always the one who dies once and says "screw it, i'm playing Marrio Tennis on my Playstation Move."

Modifié par Sinferno, 30 mars 2010 - 10:40 .

[Itkovian]

When DAO came out the forums were just as bad as this one is, any hate to love post ratio was quite similar. It takes a while for the raving to die down.

As for the bugs, I don't find them egrerious, but more like what I've come to expect for PC games. The difference is that DAO for PC was an extremely polished product (likely due to the delays for consoles), and so Awakening (and the 1.03 patch that came with it) definitely looks very bugged by comparison.

Itkovian