396 réponses à ce sujet

[Liquidcz]

Wow, this thread is flowing fast.

Um, yes she did. Talk to her after you've done all the Marjolaine dialogue options, the one about Orlesian spies and the terrible things you hear about them. She does not deny it at all. She enjoyed the chase, the "game" and the kill. Especially screwing with people's minds. And this you only learn after being in her company for a long time.

This conversation is all about how she doesn't like violence and how she used non-violent means (=seduction) whenever possible. Nothing about enjoying killing.

And I know exactly what convo you are talking about, with Zevran. I do not forget it. I also understand it in context. he is an assassin. That is his life. One he did not choose, but was chosen for him, a life from which there really is no escape. But he admits it up front, almost shortly after you meet him, and does not deny it, nor try to pretty it up.

We don't know if she became a bard willingly. It's likely, but not certain. And she was actually under a heavy influence from Marjolaine, so I could easily pull the "she was just doing what she was told to" card as well. I think we can at least agree on the fact that Leliana can be easily manipulated by a person she loves.

My point is, that others such as Sabriana have made, is that people do all sorts of moral and reasoning acrobatics to excuse or justify the less than stellar pasts of otgher party members, yet when it comes to Zevran, they go out of their way to basically convict and sentance him. And personally, I think the reasons are pretty obvious why this is done, especially when you consider the sort of persons who do this.

I personally consider Leliana and Zevran pretty much equal, as far as moralizing on their past goes. That's why I find all this "Omg Leliana is so evil, but my poor Zev, he's so pure and innocent" rather ridiculous.

And no, I don't forget that line Ejoslin mentioned. You, however, seem to conveniently ignore the fact that it is a part of conversation about how precisely that thing ("part of me loves hunting people") is what terrifies her and how she wants to get away from it.

[Addai]

Reading all the players describing their sanctimonious Wardens for whom Zevran doesn't grovel enough to suit their tastes, I can't help but think Wynne must have Fade-warped to present day and is sitting behind in a keyboard in her Chantry-issued Circle robe typing away. The image amuses me greatly.

Re. Shale, yes it seems clear that it was Wilhelm's experimentation on her that flipped a switch somewhere. In The Stolen Throne, she's a perfectly functional Orlesian-killing machine. Too bad she has no memories of that time, she might have interesting things to say about Maric and Loghain.

Modifié par Addai67, 27 mars 2010 - 08:09 .

[philippe willaume]

Red Frostraven wrote...

1: How would you know Zevran was an NPC without metagaming AND spoiling yourself?
Morrigan sais it herself, if she'd be the assassin, she'd finish the job for letting the player character not killing her.
That is the philosophy for most assassins I've ever encountered before anyway:
lie rather than die, and get the job done no matter what.

I wouldn't have had Zevran with me on the second playthrough had I not learned that he is in fact a NPC character that doesn't betray you.

And in the case of Leliana, she rage quits on your if you complete one part of the main quest in one of the two possible ways you can complete it.

Neither of the choices can be compared to the two mages, and mages have no FUNCTION other than being generally overpowered and capable of disabling non-boss enemies.

Does it mean that to "play" you have to disengage your brain? Surely you have the notion that there is a finite number of companions built in the game and since you have 3 big specialisation family.

In real life you would not know it, No you wouldn’t but in real life you do not fence in such useless way either. Surely it is clear that you are playing a game.

You have a dialog option instead of killing him right out like any other body, it a bit of a giveaway that something more is to be had
 
Since taking everything literally seems to be the flavour of the day, that is precisely what have the choice and playing through the consequences of your actions is all about.
it is very daft to complain that after you  killed the assassin becauseyou feared he wiould do you again and then get bard to have a hissy fit because I did something that would without any doubt upset her, well build a bridge and get over it.
 
Now it is not as if you needed to be the natural son of Lacan and Freud to predict what the companion will do if you take a given course of action.
So it is not that much about being smart that it is not being an f-******.
 
Most of the time I do not save before dialog and live with the consequence, yes the dialog are sometime misleading and not how I would have put it but I can leave with that.
However when it to bothers me, well amazingly enough I use my last save and get on with it
That not power gaming that and spoiling your self.
 
 
Phil

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

I do not say Zevran is pure and innocent. I am pointing out, that people seem to find excuses that make leliana's attitude towards her life's work more acceptable than Zevran's, yet in the end, both are killers who enjoyed doing what they did. But Zevran was more upfront and honest about it.



The conversation you have with her shows she has a very lacklidailsial attitude towards killing. She enjoys the hunt, the hurt. She is not worried about enjoying the killing, she is worried she will become like Marjolaine. Obsessive, paranoid, and blind. Even when she went to join the Chantry, she did not do so out of guilt, but to hide from her past.



She did become a bard willingly, she tells you this. Lady Cecile had her learn song and dance, but it was her admiration and love for marjoilaine that led her to pursue becoming a bard. She was not a slave, she was not sold to Marjolaine. She met her through the social circles she ran in. How she was manipulated later is speculative. The fact is, she chose her life.



Leliana is not any better or any worse than Zevran on the moral front. So I often find it ridiculous that people seem to think so. More often, they justify her own actions and past and dismiss it easily, but do not make the same consessions where Zevran is concerned, despite there being ample reason to do so.

[mousestalker]

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...

I do not say Zevran is pure and innocent. I am pointing out, that people seem to find excuses that make leliana's attitude towards her life's work more acceptable than Zevran's, yet in the end, both are killers who enjoyed doing what they did. But Zevran was more upfront and honest about it.

The conversation you have with her shows she has a very lacklidailsial attitude towards killing. She enjoys the hunt, the hurt. She is not worried about enjoying the killing, she is worried she will become like Marjolaine. Obsessive, paranoid, and blind. Even when she went to join the Chantry, she did not do so out of guilt, but to hide from her past.

She did become a bard willingly, she tells you this. Lady Cecile had her learn song and dance, but it was her admiration and love for marjoilaine that led her to pursue becoming a bard. She was not a slave, she was not sold to Marjolaine. She met her through the social circles she ran in. How she was manipulated later is speculative. The fact is, she chose her life.

Leliana is not any better or any worse than Zevran on the moral front. So I often find it ridiculous that people seem to think so. More often, they justify her own actions and past and dismiss it easily, but do not make the same consessions where Zevran is concerned, despite there being ample reason to do so.

It's because of the hair colour. Redheads always get away with more stuff than do blondes. When I was a child my ginger cousins could get away with lots more shenanigans than my blonde siblings and I. It's how evil gingers thrive.

[Liquidcz]

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...
The conversation you have with her shows she has a very lacklidailsial attitude towards killing. She enjoys the hunt, the hurt. She is not worried about enjoying the killing, she is worried she will become like Marjolaine. Obsessive, paranoid, and blind. Even when she went to join the Chantry, she did not do so out of guilt, but to hide from her past.

Maybe. Though I'd say this is really a subject to personal interpretation and is rather an opinion than a fact. If you feel so, nothing wrong with it.

To be honest, I've never really understood why are people so heated about the past, especially considering nothing of the wrongs Lel/Zev might have done concerns the PC. Both Leliana and Zevran are striving to be good by the time you meet them in the game, and that's what (imo) counts.

[sylvanaerie]

I figure you have to cut your companions some slack. Thedas isn't our world, its hard, dark and ugly. That's why I enjoy the romance in the game its something wonderful you can find in such a dark ugly life. Your PC's life hasn't been perfect. Depending on what you were in your Origin story (and I suppose you could play a naive innocent, not saying you have to be an awful person) but sometimes the game doesnt' give you any easy options. As Zevran points out the PC and he actually have a lot in common. People such as they don't live lives of easy contentment. Even Wynne tells your PC you weren't meant for a normal life.



I love all the companions in Origins (I cannot say the same for Awakenings) because you get a chance to see how they can atone for the things in their pasts they are not happy with. Zevran stays an assassin because he "is good at it and sees no reason not to continue" but he turns his talents to more worthy goals than just being told go here kill this. Leliana too gets to break away from that past she dislikes, affirms her faith even if you do harden her and goes off to make a difference in the world instead of living the empty life she left. Shale had several different endings cause sometimes I didn't get her approval maxed on some play throughs. She may seek to recover her lost dwarven life (not sure how to put that, the tevinter ending with wynne). Sometimes she goes back to Orzammar and fights the darkspawn. Zevran ever the follower lets you decide where he will go, either away or stay but hes happy either way. Actually happy for the first time in his life to be free.



Come to think of it...redemption seems to be a strong recurring theme in this game...

[ejoslin]

*whistles innocently* You get similar lines whether you kill Marjolaine or not, but I decided to just show the no-kill version!

Leliana: Even now, I feel some regret at not ending her life, in order to protect my own.
Warden: What's important is that you didn't act on it.
Leliana: What we're doing... what we've done--hunted men down, killed them--part of me loves it. It invigorates me and this scares me. I... I feel myself slipping. (Afraid of herself.)

Right there, she can go either way. But there's no doubt, there's a part of her that loves killing.

Modifié par ejoslin, 27 mars 2010 - 08:57 .

[Sabriana]

Exactly. To both, Sylvanaerie and Liquidcz. They both want to be free of their past, and both deserve a shot at it. I can't bring myself to harden her though, I don't want to endanger her path toward finding herself. If that's not the case, maybe I'll try it this play-through, I got her "I lied to you", and the encounter with the assassin hired by Majorlaine should be next.



Lol @ Mousestalker. Aha! I knew there was a reason my ginger haired relatives always got a break.

[sylvanaerie]

Sabriana wrote...

Exactly. To both, Sylvanaerie and Liquidcz. They both want to be free of their past, and both deserve a shot at it. I can't bring myself to harden her though, I don't want to endanger her path toward finding herself. If that's not the case, maybe I'll try it this play-through, I got her "I lied to you", and the encounter with the assassin hired by Majorlaine should be next.

Lol @ Mousestalker. Aha! I knew there was a reason my ginger haired relatives always got a break.

I got that image of redheaded stepchild in my head at that one. lol

Definitely for Leliana she has different endings if you Kill Marjolaine, not kill Marjolaine, harden not harden (has like 4 I have opened so far counting the romance). 

Your PC changes everyone depending on what choices you make.  You affect SO much in Thedas for good or ill more than just ending the Blight.  Reminds me of that chat with Wynne about power and having/using power and its consequences on the world around you.

[Sabriana]

I usually kill Majolaine, because I don't want her to come after Leliana again. Lel won't turn back to her bardic ways if my PC hardens her, does she? I wouldn't want that.

[sylvanaerie]

No. She does something for Alistair that has nothing to do with being an assassin but she is able to use her bardic skills for the betterment of humanity. (I killed Marjolaine in this particular ending)

Modifié par sylvanaerie, 27 mars 2010 - 09:25 .

[Sabriana]

Thanks, I'll give hardening her a shot then. Oh, all those new things I still find after all those months. I usually leave Leliana at camp most of the time because Zevran is such a lethal DPS rogue, but I have a plan in the works for a 3 rogue 1 mage playthrough. I guess Addai put things in my head. Bad Addai, lol.

[sylvanaerie]

Sabriana wrote...

Thanks, I'll give hardening her a shot then. Oh, all those new things I still find after all those months. I usually leave Leliana at camp most of the time because Zevran is such a lethal DPS rogue, but I have a plan in the works for a 3 rogue 1 mage playthrough. I guess Addai put things in my head. Bad Addai, lol.

Man you are going to tear through crap like tissue paper with that.

[Red Frostraven]

I never killed Marjolene, because she never attacked us herself...
(Many of my characters are sucker for individual responsibility, and won't forgive anyone for following orders blindly, but will forgive those who give the orders if they repent and accept capture. I forgave Loghain twice, but allowed Ali to kill him once. Before anyone suggests that Loghain tries to kill you, I always figured it was Howe who hired the assassins (supported by cutscene) and he had a reason to try to attack you at the landsmeet: He wants the same thing as you; to save Ferelden. (For reference, you attack him if he wins the Landsmeet))

In any case, Zevran tried to kill US, first -- then asked for OUR HELP when he failed at that task, and THEN he reforms if you butter him up enough. If you don't, he will betray you... which was the final nail in the coffin for my sake.
...
A suicide mission you say. Yet he pleads for his life when you capture him.
Yet you defend him for not defying the crows?
HE WAS, supposedly, SUICIDAL, and STILL he took a job for the crows to kill all the Grey Wardens, then he pleads for his life when he fails -- when he can have a swift death?
Make sense, much?
THEN if you let him live, he will betray you if you let him go unchecked due to, for instance, having Leliana as your primary rogue and not traveling a whole lot with him -- letting him tidy up the camp with Morrigan, Dog, Alistair and Oghren.
Didn't all that time with Alistair and ... Oghren and... well... Ok.
I can understand why he would betray me... *Shudders*
In any case, when Alistair becomes king:
"Does the Ferelden monarchy make much use of assassins? Hmm... I wonder if this is a good time to ask."
In combat:
"I love this part!"

Leliana broke out of her bardic life because of her conscience, and THEN helped US the first time we met, and she has never betrayed us.
She will not suggest nor endorse murder.
What does she scream almost EVERY time you break into armed combat and she actually sais something??
"I never liked this part!"
No amount of buttering is needed: She will fight by your side to death.
Besides, like you can say yourself in the dialogue, as a response to her fear of her liking to kill:
"Evil does not worry about not being good."
She's worried, that means she's sane.
I also note, to myself, that she cannot be tricked by Marjoleine no matter her approval, while Zevran WILL betray you if your approval is below 26.

Leliana comes across as the repentant sinner, while Zevran comes across as the assassin who'll do anything to stay alive...

Besides... how DO you cause collateral damage with swords, unless you kill people WITH women and children not only present, but locked into the same tight space as yourself and your target while fighting in the dark?

Modifié par Red Frostraven, 27 mars 2010 - 10:33 .

[HoonDing]

ejoslin wrote...

Right there, she can go either way. But there's no doubt, there's a part of her that loves killing.

She can't help it. It's the blood of Bhaal speaking.

[Sarah1281]

I never killed Marjolene, because she never attacked us herself...

That's like saying there's no need to hold Zevran against Loghain because he only hired others to try to kill you and didn't do it personally. For that matter, he never did anything to you or anyone personally. He just left at Ostagar and the darkspawn are the ones who destoryed the army and killed Cailan and the Wardens. He just put a bounty on your head and wasn't the one to attack you to try and collect it. He just gave Howe free reign to do as he pleased but didn't personally torture anyone and he certainly wasn't kidnapping elves and shipping them to Tevinter, he just okayed it. Only at the Landsmeet does he attack you but you can easily convince him to a one-on-one duel, which is apparently quite legal and not without precedent.If you want to hold Loghain responsible for any of the things he's either set into motion or caused to happen, you need to Marjolaine accountable for what she did.



Even if you ignore the fact that she had Leliana frame for treason, tortured, and she would have been killed had she not run away to Lothering, she hired assassains to kill her and everyone with her, includng you. Leliana might tell Marjolaine to go away, but Marjolaine makes it very clear she has no intention of staying gone. Yes, you only have to deal with her once in the game but how does your charcter know she won't make another attempt? She came all the way from Orlais to Denerim to see Leliana back at her side or dead, after all, so what makes you think she'll give up just because Leliana tells her to go away?

[Red Frostraven]

Sarah1281 wrote...

I never killed Marjolene, because she never attacked us herself...

That's like saying there's no need to hold Zevran against Loghain because he only hired others to try to kill you and didn't do it personally. For that matter, he never did anything to you or anyone personally. He just left at Ostagar and the darkspawn are the ones who destoryed the army and killed Cailan and the Wardens. He just put a bounty on your head and wasn't the one to attack you to try and collect it. He just gave Howe free reign to do as he pleased but didn't personally torture anyone and he certainly wasn't kidnapping elves and shipping them to Tevinter, he just okayed it. Only at the Landsmeet does he attack you but you can easily convince him to a one-on-one duel, which is apparently quite legal and not without precedent.If you want to hold Loghain responsible for any of the things he's either set into motion or caused to happen, you need to Marjolaine accountable for what she did.
 

Sorry about my untimely edit.
I didn't hold him responsible:
I talked to him at the Ostagar camp, and immediately realized that the king was a stupid fool, and that duncan had some serious and important informing to do.
(Cailan was seeing some Orlesian princess behind Anora's back for one, was expecting a legion of Cavaliers second without informing his freaking general, never told his general the importance of the grey wardens thirdly.)

Howe hired the assassin(s), Howe tortured people.
Loghain may have supported the slavery, but I put a stop to that.

Finally, if you lose at the landsmeet, YOU attack LOGHAIN.

Two of my characters are in love with personal responsibility:
You are responsible for your own actions, wheter or not you're in uniform or are doing what your mother told you.
Using your own mind is no crime, and my paladin-like character firmly believes it's better to die than to do evil in the name of others hiding behind a flag.

(Oh, there's also the two time rule: Fool me once, shame on you... fool me twice, and no amount of guards is going to save your sorry hide. This applies to leaders who sends assassins, too.)

Modifié par Red Frostraven, 27 mars 2010 - 10:51 .

[sylvanaerie]

Ugh I suck at the cut and paste. But let me reiterate I love both Leli and Zevran and recognize that each has flaws.



Leli didn't leave her bardic life because of her conscience. She left because she was betrayed by someone she loved and was trying to escape a traitor's death. By her own admission she loves the intrigues and danger of being a spy though she does say the killing she wasn't so keen on. By the time the PC meets her she has changed a lot. Her faith is making her a better person and the PC goes even further with that. I won't argue that point with you. Does she deserve a chance to make something better of herself? I think so.



Zevran is a slave. Regardless of what you want to say about him thats what he is. He isn't given a choice (at 7) to be sold to the Crows. He DOES try to kill himself by attacking the Gray Warden. That is one of the conversations you have with him but you ONLY get it after the attack by Taliesan unless you romance him. He has no money (Crows don't pay their assassins, they give them treats to stay in line) and no prospects (kill or be hunted down and killed yourself) until he meets the PC who he expected would just kill him without even finding out what he was about. Here is his first chance to get out from under the Crow's thumb and do you blame him for wanting to take it?



If you park him in camp and never get to know him of course hes going to go with Taliesan (a known commodity even if its back to a life of slavery) vs a stranger who never takes up the time to get to know him and befriend him.



Has he done things in his past he should be ashamed of? Of course, but he is HONEST about what he has done. If you talk to him he hides nothing. If you kill him for it well he hasn't lost anything anyway. Till you get the Rinna conversation he still wants to die. But if you take the time to show him a better life he starts to come out of that shell hes built around himself, opens up to you and starts to actually feel something again. Killing is all he has known. Perhaps that changes in the future. I don't know, we don't get to see that. Plus look at the stories he tells you. One he was supposed to kill a mage who tripped and broke her neck. The other he got tossed out a window and robbed by urchins. Seems to me as an assassin he was getting by on moxie and dumb luck mostly. I took the line about Ferelden nobility more as a joke than serious though he could have been, I don't know for certain. After all he also says he will make sure no one gets a clear shot on you without paying him a great deal of coin (which i know is Zevran just joking)



I believe both add a lot to the PC's life and both deserve a second chance to make something better of themselves.

[Red Frostraven]

Well... she claims she quit when the business of grand treason against Orlais happened, and that she was framed in her attempt to wash the ordeal off her hands.

[sylvanaerie]

Red Frostraven wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

I never killed Marjolene, because she never attacked us herself...

That's like saying there's no need to hold Zevran against Loghain because he only hired others to try to kill you and didn't do it personally. For that matter, he never did anything to you or anyone personally. He just left at Ostagar and the darkspawn are the ones who destoryed the army and killed Cailan and the Wardens. He just put a bounty on your head and wasn't the one to attack you to try and collect it. He just gave Howe free reign to do as he pleased but didn't personally torture anyone and he certainly wasn't kidnapping elves and shipping them to Tevinter, he just okayed it. Only at the Landsmeet does he attack you but you can easily convince him to a one-on-one duel, which is apparently quite legal and not without precedent.If you want to hold Loghain responsible for any of the things he's either set into motion or caused to happen, you need to Marjolaine accountable for what she did.
 

Sorry about my untimely edit.
I didn't hold him responsible:
I talked to him at the Ostagar camp, and immediately realized that the king was a stupid fool, and that duncan had some serious and important informing to do.
(Cailan was seeing some Orlesian princess behind Anora's back for one, was expecting a legion of Cavaliers second without informing his freaking general, never told his general the importance of the grey wardens thirdly.)

Howe hired the assassin(s), Howe tortured people.
Loghain may have supported the slavery, but I put a stop to that.

Finally, if you lose at the landsmeet, YOU attack LOGHAIN.

Two of my characters are in love with personal responsibility:
You are responsible for your own actions, wheter or not you're in uniform or are doing what your mother told you.
Using your own mind is no crime, and my paladin-like character firmly believes it's better to die than to do evil in the name of others hiding behind a flag.

(Oh, there's also the two time rule: Fool me once, shame on you... fool me twice, and no amount of guards is going to save your sorry hide)

Either I am getting tired or your post contains too many contradictions for me to assimilate.
For one Cailan wasn't seeing some Orlesian princess. You are drawing a LOT of conclusions from one letter and a crumpled up missive from Eamon.  From that I took that Eamon tried to get Cailan to put Anora aside and it pissed Cailan off.  (my opinion doesn't make it any more right or wrong but I am pointing out there is more than one way to view it).
Loghain was a fool.  He failed to take advantage of all his intelligence and I won't go into a discussion about my opinion of the hero of River Dane's tactical skills.
Cailan was a fool that I can agree with you. He was a little boy playing with toy soldiers who trusted his father in law to be there for him in the battle to pull his arse out of the sling he himself put it in.
Howe didn't hire the assassin.  LOGHAIN did.  Howe just introduced them.  Zevran will tell you he was hired by Loghain.  Howe tortured people under Loghain's direction or at the least with impunity knowing Loghain would protect him.

Responsiblity flows uphill in the military.  If your men screw up its not just  the  screw ups who are held responsible its their leader who let them screw up too. (I speak from personal experience as I spent almost 9 years in the military).  Granted thats not a long time but its long enough to understand how the chain of command works.

Do you hate on the gun that shot you or the man who pulled the trigger? Loghain pointed Zevran at the PC's and it was ultimately him i was angry at, not Zevran.

*Edited cause now I have to go.  My family wants FOOOOOOOD!

Modifié par sylvanaerie, 27 mars 2010 - 10:58 .

[Red Frostraven]

If you watched the cutscene, Loghain didn't think much of the idea of the assassin... which made me like Loghain a tad; It hadn't crossed his mind.

As for those trying to kill me, I hate the first self-concious part in the chain of command the most, then the last chain in the command to kill me second.
If i guy hires a guy to kill me, and that guy who is hired to kill me fires a gun -- I do not hate the bullet.
I do not hate the gunpowder.
I do not hate the manufacturer of the round.
I do not hate the firing pin.
I do not hate the trigger.
I do not hate the gun.
I do hate the guy pulling the trigger.
I do not hate his cellphone.
I do not hate his boss' cellphone.
I do hate his boss who issued the command.

As an individualist, I don't buy the concept of Zevran being the sword in the hand of Loghain, suggesting he is not at fault.
He was a snake in the hand of Loghain, and the moment that snake decided to strike, the snake lost it's right to life.
It was his choice to bite, and Loghain did not strike, it was the snake in his hand who tried to bite me. Once the snake was dead, Loghain did in fact not pull another weapon.

Once I destroyed the gun aimed at me, the wielder of the gun did not pull out his sidearm.

I literally hate this whole "it wasn't me, it was the guy above me" game.
What if the guy on the top is commanded by a god?
Is god responsible?
Should you just walk home and let those that tried to kill you walk home, and the guy on top go free because he's insane?
What about the people listening to an insane leader?
It is those people who allow evil rulers to exist, those who do not question authority.
No.

Anyone acting on behalf of others is responsible for acting on the words of others, and are responsible for not thinking for themselves.
The assassin and the issuer of the command are both equally responsible in my book.

This is the ethics for two of my individualist characters, and not my own.

Modifié par Red Frostraven, 27 mars 2010 - 11:54 .

[Sarah1281]

I still don't see how letting Marjolaine live when she clearly has no intention to stop hunting Leliana (which she realizes when she goes back to Orlais to confront Marjolaine at the end when you don't kill her) and thus will keep attacking you makes any sense. Unless you force Leliana to leave after that as she's too dangerous to be around?

Modifié par Sarah1281, 27 mars 2010 - 11:58 .

[Red Frostraven]

She didn't strike us: Her thugs did, stupid as they were to follow someone without asking questions.

Besides, it was not my choice to make:
They came for Leliana, it was her choice to make in what to do with her former lover.
Leliana didn't choose to kill her.

If Marjoleine had tried a second time, it would be her life.
AND it would rid the world of even more assassins who kill anyone by orders, for money.
Good riddance.

Edit: Personally, I wished she'd try to kill us there, so that I had an opportunity to kill her, but alas. She did not attack.

Modifié par Red Frostraven, 28 mars 2010 - 12:07 .

[Sarah1281]

She hired them, though, which in your previous analogy makes her "his boss who issued the command." Besides, Leliana's decision depends on what you say. If you say 'Oh, Leliana's a good person' then she'll feel compelled to try and prove it by just asking Marjolaine to leave. If you point out that Marjolaine won't stop until Leliana is dead, Leliana decides to kill her. Either way, Leliana makes the choice but it depends on whether you make her focus on proving Marjolaine wrong immediately and dealing with practicalities later or dealing with practicalities now and proving Marjolaine wrong later.