573 réponses à ce sujet

[rak72]

For those that can't get past Sten being so much bigger than the female warden - Don't forget that Alistair is still there, and he's got your back.

[HoonDing]

HaloKT wrote...

Yeah, it's absolutely possible - even as a very skinny girl - to fare reasonably well against blokes. And I share yopur thoughts about huge 2H weapons on (human) women. Just doesn't fit somehow. A staff-like weapon or spear, absolutely. A 2H axe or hammer? Less likely IMO. Those are bruteforce weapons, you do have to have a lot of muscle to make them work.

In reality, two-handed swords don't weigh as much as they seem to do in the game. A flamberge has a weight of no more than 5 lbs.

It's only the armour that would require a lot of muscle power (a full set of medieval knight armour weighed around 50 lbs)... but since every warrior, male or female, in the game has the ability to sprint in heavy armour, they shouldn't lack the strength to swing around a two-handed weapon.

Modifié par virumor, 26 mars 2010 - 03:24 .

[errant_knight]

virumor wrote...

HaloKT wrote...

Yeah, it's absolutely possible - even as a very skinny girl - to fare reasonably well against blokes. And I share yopur thoughts about huge 2H weapons on (human) women. Just doesn't fit somehow. A staff-like weapon or spear, absolutely. A 2H axe or hammer? Less likely IMO. Those are bruteforce weapons, you do have to have a lot of muscle to make them work.

In reality, two-handed swords don't weigh as much as they seem to do in the game. A flamberge has a weight of no more than 5 lbs.

It's only the armour that would require a lot of muscle power (a full set of medieval knight armour weighed around 100 lbs)... but since every warrior, male or female, in the game has the ability to sprint in heavy armour, they shouldn't lack the strength to swing around a two-handed weapon.

We can also jump twenty feet into the air and kill an ogre in slow motion. An ogre, folks. Does this say anything  to anyone?

[mousestalker]

errant_knight wrote...

virumor wrote...

HaloKT wrote...

Yeah, it's absolutely possible - even as a very skinny girl - to fare reasonably well against blokes. And I share yopur thoughts about huge 2H weapons on (human) women. Just doesn't fit somehow. A staff-like weapon or spear, absolutely. A 2H axe or hammer? Less likely IMO. Those are bruteforce weapons, you do have to have a lot of muscle to make them work.

In reality, two-handed swords don't weigh as much as they seem to do in the game. A flamberge has a weight of no more than 5 lbs.

It's only the armour that would require a lot of muscle power (a full set of medieval knight armour weighed around 100 lbs)... but since every warrior, male or female, in the game has the ability to sprint in heavy armour, they shouldn't lack the strength to swing around a two-handed weapon.

We can also jump twenty feet into the air and kill an ogre in slow motion. An ogre, folks. Does this say anything  to anyone?

Yes, we are that awesome.

[HoonDing]

errant_knight wrote...

We can also jump twenty feet into the air and kill an ogre in slow motion. An ogre, folks. Does this say anything  to anyone?

And apparently, also have sex in full plate armour.

Then again, that was maybe a bug.

[mousestalker]

virumor wrote...

errant_knight wrote...

We can also jump twenty feet into the air and kill an ogre in slow motion. An ogre, folks. Does this say anything  to anyone?

And apparently, also have sex in full plate armour.

Then again, that was maybe a bug.

Given how the taint can effect everything from people to wolves to microorganisms, that's just prudence.

[sylvanaerie]

ejoslin wrote...

Nhadalie wrote...


But the HN origin is so funny when you play it as a man-****. 

Fergus: Someday, you'll find yourself a woman.

HNM: No less than 3 please.

Fergus: Not just some roll in the hay. A woman that you actually want more than that with.

Too bad there isn't a "No way! That's impossible!" reaction to that. Or something really overdramatic. But then, I haven't played Caedin past that point yet. Somehow telling Fergus that you have someone waiting for you makes more sense as a male too. I can't really see a brother and sister having that close of a relationship that she'd tell him when she was sleeping with someone. Though his reaction to the HNF is amusing too, in a "I'll hurt him if he even thinks about hurting you." sort of way.

HNF gets that too, the line about 3 men, except Oriana lectures her about not getting caught! 

Edit: yes, yes, I did.

LOL Fergus's reaction to her advice is funny too. "Im not sure how I should take that, love" and she replies "Merely the advice of a practical Antivan woman."  Gotta love them pragmatists...and she gets points for being Antivan too

[roundcrow]

virumor wrote...

errant_knight wrote...

We can also jump twenty feet into the air and kill an ogre in slow motion. An ogre, folks. Does this say anything  to anyone?

And apparently, also have sex in full plate armour.

Then again, that was maybe a bug.

I thought it was funny when my AW had sex with Arcane Shield and Combat Magic active.  I suppose you can't be *too* careful.  

[errant_knight]

roundcrow wrote...

virumor wrote...

errant_knight wrote...

We can also jump twenty feet into the air and kill an ogre in slow motion. An ogre, folks. Does this say anything  to anyone?

And apparently, also have sex in full plate armour.

Then again, that was maybe a bug.

I thought it was funny when my AW had sex with Arcane Shield and Combat Magic active.  I suppose you can't be *too* careful.  

That's really, really safe sex.

Modifié par errant_knight, 26 mars 2010 - 03:47 .

[Thor Rand Al]

Like you Axekix when I first started playing this my first 3 characters where male also, but my reason was because I've never really been able to get into playing a female in other games. So when I did finally decide to play a female in Origin's, well lets put it this way, I'm hooked lol. It's so much more fun and challenging playing a female. The romance with Alistair so far is more challenging. When I played a male and did the romances with Lel and Morrigan I couldn't get myself to really get into it, it was bland for me but playing a female and doing the romance's I'm more able to get into it, (especially with Alistair) lol.

The fact that you are a female period I find a major challenge because of the way people do view women and being a warrior, which I always find myself playing lol. That and when I do import my character in Awakening's I've really got a challenge on my hands. Reason being is because of the last Warden-Commander in Fereldan was a woman and regardless of how some people think whether she was in the right or not she was still a female and the Warden's where banned from Fereldan because of her. So not only do I have to prove that the Warden's should be allowed in Fereldan but that a female can be the Warden-Commander despite what happened the last time.

I'm a little surprised actually to see nothing about that in the story, I actually wish there was lol. Would make it more interesting I think in a good way lol

[sylvanaerie]

Thor Rand Al wrote...

Like you Axekix when I first started playing this my first 3 characters where male also, but my reason was because I've never really been able to get into playing a female in other games. So when I did finally decide to play a female in Origin's, well lets put it this way, I'm hooked lol. It's so much more fun and challenging playing a female. The romance with Alistair so far is more challenging. When I played a male and did the romances with Lel and Morrigan I couldn't get myself to really get into it, it was bland for me but playing a female and doing the romance's I'm more able to get into it, (especially with Alistair) lol.
The fact that you are a female period I find a major challenge because of the way people do view women and being a warrior, which I always find myself playing lol. That and when I do import my character in Awakening's I've really got a challenge on my hands. Reason being is because of the last Warden-Commander in Fereldan was a woman and regardless of how some people think whether she was in the right or not she was still a female and the Warden's where banned from Fereldan because of her. So not only do I have to prove that the Warden's should be allowed in Fereldan but that a female can be the Warden-Commander despite what happened the last time.
I'm a little surprised actually to see nothing about that in the story, I actually wish there was lol. Would make it more interesting I think in a good way lol

In Awakenings you get a couple of lines about the last warden commander but nothing in relation to her gender just her actions causing such a ruckus.

[Carmen_Willow]

Axekix wrote...

(TLDR at the bottom)
Let me preface this by saying I don’t mean for this to be offensive.  Really I’m just interested in hearing some different view points on the matter. 

I have never beaten DA:O with a female PC.  I’ve tried… I mean of the dozens of characters I’ve made, at least ½ are female, but the only 3 I’ve ever taken to the end of the game are male.  I seem to lose interest in my female chars after 1-2 contracts at best and reroll.

It’s not so much an issue with RPing a female.  I mean when playing DA I don’t play every character as “myself.”  I view playing DA like directing a movie.  I don’t have to put myself personally into the character to enjoy it.  The problem is it just seems to me that a lot of the plot points in the game are better tailored to a male lead.  Note: this is mostly concerning the HNF and CEF origins.  I prefer playing melee to mages.

First of all, there’s Alistair!  As a male he’s kind of a funny/quirky/at times annoying sidekick and friend.  I actually like him as a character.  But as a female he just seems so wussy!

An example of what I mean is, when you get to Lothering, he’s the senior warden, following Ostagar.  He’s probably the most experienced member of your team, and also (storyline wise) probably the strongest at the time (he‘s a temp so he‘d have an advantage over Morrigan, and he‘s been trained for field combat since he was 12).  A female PC at that point has some casual training (either from her father as a HNF, or from her long deceased mother CEF), but only had their first real taste of war at Ostagar.  So, instead of stepping up and setting an example, (in an age where chivalry was at it’s height no less) he dumps ALL the responsibility on the female PC.

This isn’t quite as bad with a male PC.  Granted Alistair’s still slightly more experienced, but he’s not necessarily stronger than a male PC at that time (HNM origin, for example, states that you beat Dairren at the last melee tourney.  Females don’t get that dialogue).

It just seems so… unmanly.  I wish he stepped up to the bat there.  I know there are gameplay reasons for it, but it still leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

Then there’s Sten.  I’ve always felt like the storyline reasons given for recruiting him are thin.  I mean even for a male PC, the thought of freeing and arming a 7 foot tall, self proclaimed murderer seems… unwise.  But really, as a female PC, Sten is like 3x your size (4x if you’re an elf!).  Unless you’re playing a mage, what hope does some hundred-something lb woman have of keeping him in line if he decides to get crazy again? 

Granted I know his story, but at the time my PC wouldn’t.  I can’t find any way for a female PC to justify releasing him.  Especially considering the only person you could really depend on for protection then would be Alistair (lol).  Yet, I don’t want to leave him because he’s one of my favorite characters later on.  *sigh*

Then of course, there’s the romances.  I really don’t see the appeal of Alistair or Zevran.  And I don’t say that just because I’m a guy.  Alistair is just lame.  I think I read that in the end he doesn’t even propose to your PC, that you actually have to “force” it on him at the landsmeet (seriously?).  And Zev comes off as really sleazy to me (though I’ve never really gotten to know him well in any of my playthroughs).  I could go with Lel, but I’ve been there/done that as a male already.  Am I missing something?

Last but not least there‘s Morrigan.  She’s probably my fav DA char overall.  So I’m wondering how her relationship develops with a female PC.  I know she’s not a love interest, but I like keeping her in my party, and having her play a big role in all of my games.  I’m kind of worried that she’ll be harder to warm up to with a fem PC (correct me if I’m wrong).  Also there’s the issue of the dark ritual… it just seems much less contrived to have a male PC who loves/loved her do it than Alistair (lol again).

There’s plenty more but this post is already way too long as is.  Can anyone give me some counterarguments to some of this?  I’d really like to finish a female playthrough for the achievements and to see the other side of the story, but every time I try I’m just overwhelmed by the cognitive dissonance.  I’m not being sexist am I? 

TL:DR- Dragon Age seems to work better with a male PC.  How do you make HNF/CEF work?

I don't see Alistair as lame.  I see him as immature. You have to figure that these characters are in their 20's, probably early 20's.  Don't know your age, but I can tell you most guys don't hit their real stride in the maturity area until they hit their 30's.  And Alistair has flashes of the leader he can become but isn't yet.  Finally Alistair, who had never known the security of a loving family, has just lost his "family."  While the character has as well, she comes from years of safety and security that he did not know. 

Alistair is the Fool at the beginning of DA:O, going off into the unknown pretty clueless.  But he grows up a lot over the year on the road becomes the King....And a smart woman sees the man he can become, not the boy he still is.

Part of the challenge of playing the female lead is convincing Alistair that he needs to do something that goes totally against his desires in order to survive. It's a real challenge, and one playthrough when I couldn't convince him, I was so p/o'd at him I let him die. It was interesting.

Morrigan, after her upbringing, will probably never be able to see men as something other than a thing to be manipulated...yes, I've played her male love interest, but Morrigan ultimately chooses her perception of safety; i.e., "survival" and "power" over love.  With a female warden, she can have a friend without the procreation, biological thing getting in the way.

I agree with you about Sten.  Sten cannot be trusted not to try and kill you, and while I still set him free, it's because I agree with Leilianna that leaving him to be eaten by darkspawn or worse is inhuman.  But I park him at camp much of the time. Plus he seems to have a much harder time warming up to a female warrior/leader.  I feel like I have to "buy" not only his approval, but my very life with his quest. Plus, at the end of the game, I am sending back to his own people an experienced warrior who now knows the enemy (Fereldans) quite well indeed. 

Zev. No comment.

 

[Nhadalie]

Carmen_Willow wrote...


Morrigan, after her upbringing, will probably never be able to see men as something other than a thing to be manipulated...yes, I've played her male love interest, but Morrigan ultimately chooses her perception of safety; i.e., "survival" and "power" over love.  With a female warden, she can have a friend without the procreation, biological thing getting in the way.


 

I have to disagree a bit about Morrigan. Her actions with the dark ritual can either be seen as her most selfless act, or her most selfish one. Depending on her relationship with the PC. If she is close to the PC, she is giving them a chance to live while putting herself into a situation that she is no way prepared for. Morrigan has no idea how to handle children, much less how to raise her own and deal with everything that comes with it. Especially not when she realizes that she's playing right into Flemeth's plans, and that Flemeth is never really gone. Even if the PC did kill her.

If she is not close to the PC, the PC has no way of knowing what Morrigan's motivations for the dark ritual might be. We have no way of knowing what she plans for the child, or what she is going to do. Whereas with the above situation, there is a lot more trust involved. Because you know that Morrigan isn't going to try to possess the child, since she finds the idea abhorrent, and it seems impossible to do so.(The special thing about the child is the soul. Flemeth's body swapping destroys the soul of the former owner of the body.)

[DWSmiley]

HaloKT wrote...

Yeah, it's absolutely possible - even as a very skinny girl - to fare reasonably well against blokes. And I share yopur thoughts about huge 2H weapons on (human) women. Just doesn't fit somehow. A staff-like weapon or spear, absolutely. A 2H axe or hammer? Less likely IMO. Those are bruteforce weapons, you do have to have a lot of muscle to make them work.

Still, I think SnB works out fine with human females. But then again, there is a certain amount of swooning over Cauthrien on my part, soooo... I might be waaaay off there

Edit:
Fergus also calls you a saucy minx if you just happen to invite Iona over for... a nice cup of tea and some biscuits *puts on very sincere look*

Aand another edit! My CEF Rogue has Master Coercion and around 40ish  Cunning, and I managed to sway Cauthrien over to letting me pass without a fight. It was indeed quite touching, with her losing all her beliefs in her idol and hero.

It's quite the contrast with Loghain's two companions, eh? I can't wait to kill Howe - a dagger in the guts is too good for him - while Ser Cauthrien is the character I least want to fight. She's an awesome woman and her anger clearly stems from fearing to question her hero worship. But I'll won't surrender in the first fight because I want to see if I can ever win it. I thought I might once - over half the archers were down and she was at about half hit points. My party was in pretty good shape, or so I thought. Then bam! She dropped Alistair with a critical hit and then tore through the rest of us like the proverbial hot knife and butter. Fierce.

Modifié par DWSmiley, 26 mars 2010 - 05:09 .

[Addai]

Re. Sten: Whatever threat he poses to you has to be counterbalanced by the fact that you now have human mobs in addition to a darkspawn horde threatening you. You're in deep doo. A six foot tall giant who's willing to fight for you is a risk you should probably take.

[SurelyForth]

Addai67 wrote...

Re. Sten: Whatever threat he poses to you has to be counterbalanced by the fact that you now have human mobs in addition to a darkspawn horde threatening you. You're in deep doo. A six foot tall giant who's willing to fight for you is a risk you should probably take.

Hee! How short is Alistair if Sten is only six feet tall?

To contribute: DAO is the first video game where the gender of my character completely changes the way I played the game. My female PC's are empowered by the way everyone seemed to recognize their strength and superiority and they work even harder to be awesome. My male PC's are unexceptional and entitled (even my male CE was a smug jerk when it came down to it).

Modifié par SurelyForth, 26 mars 2010 - 05:19 .

[Addai]

Ok, I meant 8 feet tall. You get my drift, at any rate.

Re. Alistair and his appeal: *book spoilers follow*



In The Calling, Fiona (a pretty badass female in her own right) gets to a point where she looks at Maric and realizes that he is a genuinely good man, the last thing she expected to find in a human king. And his son is, as well. Is it really so hard to believe that that is all a woman wants? Not a father figure or a lion, just a partner who happens to be a really good man?

Modifié par Addai67, 26 mars 2010 - 05:22 .

[rak72]

Carmen_Willow wrote...

....And a smart woman sees the man he can become, not the boy he still is.


 

well put

[Godak]

Addai67 wrote...

Not a father figure or a lion, just a partner who happens to be a really good man?

It better be enough...I can't see me being very fatherly to any future romantic interests, and I'm not much for cats.

[DWSmiley]

virumor wrote...

HaloKT wrote...

Yeah, it's absolutely possible - even as a very skinny girl - to fare reasonably well against blokes. And I share yopur thoughts about huge 2H weapons on (human) women. Just doesn't fit somehow. A staff-like weapon or spear, absolutely. A 2H axe or hammer? Less likely IMO. Those are bruteforce weapons, you do have to have a lot of muscle to make them work.

In reality, two-handed swords don't weigh as much as they seem to do in the game. A flamberge has a weight of no more than 5 lbs.

It's only the armour that would require a lot of muscle power (a full set of medieval knight armour weighed around 50 lbs)... but since every warrior, male or female, in the game has the ability to sprint in heavy armour, they shouldn't lack the strength to swing around a two-handed weapon.

A woman could swing a 2H weapon but never as well as an equally skilled man.  Muscle mass is essential to be the best.  Females have many other ways to be the Hero of Ferelden, though!  

[Raiil]

DWSmiley wrote...

virumor wrote...

HaloKT wrote...

Yeah, it's absolutely possible - even as a very skinny girl - to fare reasonably well against blokes. And I share yopur thoughts about huge 2H weapons on (human) women. Just doesn't fit somehow. A staff-like weapon or spear, absolutely. A 2H axe or hammer? Less likely IMO. Those are bruteforce weapons, you do have to have a lot of muscle to make them work.

In reality, two-handed swords don't weigh as much as they seem to do in the game. A flamberge has a weight of no more than 5 lbs.

It's only the armour that would require a lot of muscle power (a full set of medieval knight armour weighed around 50 lbs)... but since every warrior, male or female, in the game has the ability to sprint in heavy armour, they shouldn't lack the strength to swing around a two-handed weapon.

A woman could swing a 2H weapon but never as well as an equally skilled man.  Muscle mass is essential to be the best.  Females have many other ways to be the Hero of Ferelden, though!  

And the woman, given sufficent strength, can develop that muscle mass.

Men and women are not born with one sort of body. Speaking as a female myself, i'm on the taller side and stronger than most women and men of my general build. A woman with the right bodily disposition will be better equipped to use that two handed sword better than a man who isn't.

In the character creator, men and women are treated as equals in Ferelden. There is no reason for a woman to not be able to use the same abilities.

[Ceridraen]

As I read it, we're basically innate leaders. We're not just brawn/power, but we have some natural talent at overall direction. Therefore, gender doesn't matter at all. The Iceni were led by a woman, and when it comes to magic, there's no difference, anyway.



Also, historically speaking, as it turns out, 2 handed weapons were NOT heavy, they were actually fast. (as opposed to the traditional gaming '2handers are slow but hit hard.') This is a conventional wisdom that's proven quite recently to be inaccurate. Our knowledge of weapons & fighting is Asian, but as it turns out, northern European fighting & style was quite different. It wasn't recorded or 'canonized' in the same way, so we know less about it.

[DWSmiley]

Valentia X wrote...

And the woman, given sufficent strength, can develop that muscle mass.

Men and women are not born with one sort of body. Speaking as a female myself, i'm on the taller side and stronger than most women and men of my general build. A woman with the right bodily disposition will be better equipped to use that two handed sword better than a man who isn't.

In the character creator, men and women are treated as equals in Ferelden. There is no reason for a woman to not be able to use the same abilities.

I should have been clearer.  An exceptional woman could become a better 2H warrior than many men but she could never become the best 2H warrior in the kingdom and, by the time of the final battle, I think of my Warden as the very best at what s/he does.

Well, even as I type this I'm thinking of one way it maybe could be "believable".  Perhaps the enhancements one gains in the Fade make her truly superwoman.  After all, as others have mentioned, swinging a 2H weapon is mild compared to sprinting in massive armor or leaping 10 feet to dispatch an ogre.  

Modifié par DWSmiley, 26 mars 2010 - 06:21 .

[BubbleDncr]

1. Alistair - He tells you at the beginning that he's not a good leader. That's just how some people are. Doesn't matter if I'm male or female. And since I'm Dalish, I'm just as glad to not have to follow some human's orders.

2. Sten - I killed an Orge before I met Sten, and that WAY bigger than him. I'm tough, I can take Sten.

3. Alistair/Zev Romance - I find them both appealing, in different ways. Zev is fun and intriguing, but Alistair makes my Dalish Elf want to be a good person. So my character actually had some growth and development throughout the game. All cos of Alistair. And I find that a very appealing part of the game.

4. Morrigan Choice - I think this decision is actually difficult and important as a female. On one hand, you can either die or let your love die. On the other hand, you can convince your LOVE to sleep with another woman, which is emotionally hard to do all by itself, but you add on to the fact that you're possibly screwing the world over with a demon god child. So as a male, you can either be selfish and get to sleep with some chick, or be selfless and die. Female: be seflish but deal with the emotional turmoil of convincing your love to sleep with another woman, or be selfless and die.

[DWSmiley]

BubbleDncr wrote...

4. Morrigan Choice - I think this decision is actually difficult and important as a female. On one hand, you can either die or let your love die. On the other hand, you can convince your LOVE to sleep with another woman, which is emotionally hard to do all by itself, but you add on to the fact that you're possibly screwing the world over with a demon god child. So as a male, you can either be selfish and get to sleep with some chick, or be selfless and die. Female: be seflish but deal with the emotional turmoil of convincing your love to sleep with another woman, or be selfless and die.

My HNF Elissa tried very hard to find another way.  She hardened Alistair, told Morrigan where to go, convinced Alistair and Anora to a political marriage, made it clear to Anora that she (Elissa) was "still in the picture", and spared Loghain so he could make the ultimate sacrifice.  I hoped I could salvage the romance after Loghain died but alas, no such luck.  So Elissa went travelling with Zevran instead.