75 réponses à ce sujet

[jshunt01]

Eli-da-Mage wrote...

Don't worry this whole threads as on topic as Bush.
Yeah i have alot of ammunition prepared for the US xD

D*mn..that bad off topic?  Is that even possible...

It seems like our "representatives" go out of their way to make us targets.  Sometimes the truth hurts...or is at the least very embarrassing.

Modifié par jshunt01, 26 mars 2010 - 10:18 .

[DianeLyn56]

Well back on topic, I am happy for the people who aren't having problems playing Awakening and are enjoying it. I also feel bad for the people who are having problems and hope that Bioware will get some patches out soon.

[jellmoo32]

Haexpane wrote...

jellmoo32 wrote...

Eli-da-Mage wrote...

Your argument sounded reasonable and i wouldn't label you as a "whiner". Those that insult others who liked the game and argue against everything they say are.

Does the opposite hold true though? Those that mindlessly defend the title and insult those that do not, would you say that they are "fanboys"?

I don't "mindlessly defend" anything, thanks for the insult tho

No insult was intended, and I apologize if you felt that one was implied. It was purely a hypothetical.

I was only attempting to see if Eli-da-Mage thought that the opposite was true. i.e. Since he felt that those who mindlessly bashed the game and insulted others were "whiners", would he say that those whom mindlessly heaped virtues onto the game and insulted those who don't share the same viewpoint should be labeled as "fanboys".

[jshunt01]

jellmoo32 wrote...

Haexpane wrote...

jellmoo32 wrote...

Eli-da-Mage wrote...

Your argument sounded reasonable and i wouldn't label you as a "whiner". Those that insult others who liked the game and argue against everything they say are.

Does the opposite hold true though? Those that mindlessly defend the title and insult those that do not, would you say that they are "fanboys"?

I don't "mindlessly defend" anything, thanks for the insult tho

No insult was intended, and I apologize if you felt that one was implied. It was purely a hypothetical.

I was only attempting to see if Eli-da-Mage thought that the opposite was true. i.e. Since he felt that those who mindlessly bashed the game and insulted others were "whiners", would he say that those whom mindlessly heaped virtues onto the game and insulted those who don't share the same viewpoint should be labeled as "fanboys".

Jell.

Not speaking for "da mage" or anyone else - nor is this directed to specific person.  The key word is "MINDLESSLY" in both cases.  Even though I don't agree with some posts on both sides of the issue, I think most reasonable (or semi-mature) folks don't have issues if they are presented well.  I've actually seen some good discussion (a few that,) it's when they degenerate in name calling, intentional baiting, etc that some folks lose patience, specifically folks who spend a lot of time in (any) forum.  If you have a compliant..state it, explain it, and support it with examples.  Most importantly though, at least be willing to consider a different viewpoint, even if you don't agree at least show a little respect.

Edit:  For those who feel they have a "valid" gripe - I found asking questions before jumping into a fire can save you getting burned (sometimes badly.) 

EXAMPLE of common gripe:   Instead of saying "X sucks because it lacks Y";  Think through the issue - say the issue is "I didn't like how easy the game was" => Try something like:   "While playing the DA:O on the hardest setting I still found this game to easy for my tastes, does any know of some MODs that adds a little more muscle to the AI?"  There are a lot of folks who put hard work into their mods that might jump on that; You'll probably get replies recommending "Hey..instead of playing a X class, try playing Y and not use health potions... ."  You are now contributing to the community:  1) You make a point  2) You may actually get something resolved 3) You are making the community stronger by pulling in others 4) Set an example and maybe even get a little respect for your viewpoint.

Modifié par jshunt01, 26 mars 2010 - 11:24 .

[Xionraserai]

well it seems my thread went to a whole different way as is was supposed to be >.>

i didnt mean to insult anyone by calling him a "hater" thats why i put it in ""



there are a lot of ppl just whining all the time about the same things like all those millions of "i hate ohgren" threads ... its something you cant change bioware decided ohgren so it shall be nothing to change so why everyone cry? i dont understand, instead of just being happy there IS a expansion at all



with this thread i just wanted to pull out positive criticism as well in between aaaall the many "BW sucks" "awakening sucks" threads in this forum

there is productive criticism and the counterpart which is just insulting for the corporation and doesnt help anyone at all



i admit there are bugs, and i didnt try to use the rune creation thingy cos i wasnt interested in it

all i said was in total i liked awakening it was a nice addition to the original game nice comrades nice story even if it was to less but hey there are more to come, i have the feeling the most ppl want everything of dragon age asap and now a whole 5 million hours game with every single idea inside



BW said they support DA 2 years with DLC and expansions and you cant really judge them on one single DLC (RTO) that went bad ... we all make mistakes



so please guys keep beeing nice to each other stop insulting each other und try to use positive and productive criticism



thanks and happy playing ^^

[Yrkoon]

jellmoo32 wrote...

For the love of...

People are "haters" because they are playing a game riddled with serious bugs and complaining about it? People are "haters" because they are irritated that DLC content does not transfer over? People are "haters" because the expansion does not actually add anything new to Origins?

Listen, I am glad you liked it. More power to you. I am also glad that you had a largley bug free experience. Many of us did not, and many of us feel that the title was unpolished and rushed to the shelves. That does not make us "haters". It simply means we have an opinion. No more, but also no less valid than your own.

The funny thing is, if you read his post closely, he's actually Parroting the very  same criticisms of the game that the rest of us so-called "haters" have


Check it out:

Xionraserai wrote...

i found one major bug at the beginning which you can avoid easily, but the rest of the game just ran ok if you oversee some minor graphik bugs

So... a Major bug, and some graphics glitches

 the story is a little big thin

A thin story.

gave me fun for atleast 20 hours

Only  20 hours long

the only thing i was sad was thats its over already,

Translation:  That's it?

 it has a really great potential and i wished the story were deeper and i would have had more time, way more time to "learn to know?" the companions like velanna and anders better

Unrealized potential.  Shallow story,  Companions need to be fleshed out more.

Isn't  this what we've been saying?

Modifié par Yrkoon, 27 mars 2010 - 01:29 .

[DKJaigen]

Isn't  this what we've been saying?

Some people act like this is a game you wouldnt give to your worst enemy, I liked awakening but its of a lesser grade quality then orgins still its money well spend

[Yrkoon]

Darth Wraith wrote...

I'm having a grand time with Awakening. Apart from being unable to trigger Sigrun's quest I haven't seen a single bug anywhere.

And as for Awakening "not adding anything new to Origins", that's just silly. It adds 20+ hours of gameplay, raised level cap, a whole mess of new items, spells, skills and talents and new companions. If that's not adding something new, what would you say qualifies?

There is way, WAY too much whining on these forums.  

^There's also some flat-out FALSE statements being made on this thread.

Awakenings does NOT   add any new Items to Origins.  It does NOT raise the level cap in Origins.  It does NOT add a single talent, skill, spell or companion to Origins.  If it did, I'd be absolutely satisfied, and I'd be here gushing the praise.

But since it doesn't add any of those things to Origins,    It feels like a seperate New game, but it's as short as an  expansion.  It's officially labeled as an expansion, but it adds nothing to  Origins itself.

So pretty much its a module.  A module  with a $40 price tag  (oh Shi- ... I'm "whining" again)  Silly me, refusing to be impressed by an average effort.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 27 mars 2010 - 02:13 .

[Feraele]

jellmoo32 wrote...

Why does it have to be split like this? So black and white? It seems like people who love Awakening and say so are derided as "fanboys" while those that either did not like the game or complain about the multitude of bugs are labeled as "whiners" or "haters"?

By this point there are a ton of threads both pro and anti Awakening, with people acting like frothing lunatics from both sides. If you bought the expansion and enjoyed it, and either are not encountering or do not mind the bugs I am happy for you. Seriously. I am glad that you have a product that you enjoy. That being said, I don't think that my explaining the problems I have with the title (whether they be technical or personal opinion) should make me a "whiner".

I think the label "whiner" is bandied about far too often,  I see it as an attempt to denigrate another's opinion.  

Some folks have a problem discerning between actual "whining" and people voicing an opinion.  

I put that down to perhaps, a lack in vocabulary..or maybe just ineptitude at discerning what is what.

Far as I am concerned..there are things I LIKE about Awakening and some things I don't like..ie: lack of continuity and plot holes.   I  am here for the story...for the most part,  not here to "beat da game"  or kill MOAR uber mobs.

[Angband21]

Eli-da-Mage wrote...

I didn't say you did. I'm just posting my opinion that there is very little point in moaning about it. Don't even try to pull the pathetic excuse that your giving feedback because if you truly were then feedback includes the things you did like about the game and i really doubt that you thought that every single aspect of the game was bad.

Sucking up and defending the bugginess won't get  you a discount on the next release.
When people feel that they have been dealt a raw deal they complain. Of course, some take it up the *** and don't complain about the lack of vaseline. To each his own.

[Xionraserai]

i find it very amusing how ppl take words you say and twist them around so they sound bad like mr. Yrkoon here

i never said this game is perfect and i also stated above that there is productional criticism and insulting criticism

for example: "this game sucks" is insulting criticism whereas "imo the story was a bit thin and could be deeper" is productional criticism

many ppl here dont seem to get the difference of those 2 getting mad at bioware and insult the team which isnt fair
the tone makes the music
in other words if you dont have something good to say you shouldnt say anything at all, that just as a hint for cultured conversation

Modifié par Xionraserai, 27 mars 2010 - 02:48 .

[Feraele]

Cultured conversation..on these forums? hehehe That will be the day

[Obtusifolius]

Haexpane wrote...

DianeLyn56 wrote...

I will repeat, since it seems to not be sinking in, I never said you called me a name but you do insult and name call a lot in this forum. You are not calling anyone specifically because you would be thrown out.

You are accusing me of namecalling, in a thread when I haven't called anyone names, and then say I do it all the time... where? When? 
It's not a fair statement.   Calling "haters" .."asstards" is hardly name calling.  As "haters" is already a name/label for a behaviour, but a super generic one.

Lets look at it logically, I bet you would agree that "haters" are "eraging asstards" would you not?

Try looking at it logically yourself: just because somebody might agree with you calling 'haters' raging asstards, that does not mean you are not calling them names.

The 'haters' tag may be a 'super generic' label for a kind of behaviour, but the fact is that you are calling these people names (not to mention labelling them haters to begin with). If you were describing the specific behabiour of 'hating' as asstardish, or whatever word you want to use, then fine, you could credibly argue that you were not 'calling names'. However, since you chose to insult the 'haters' rather than the 'hating', you have shown yourself to be a hypocrite. Hence the 'kettle, black' comment.

worksa8 wrote...

Good and bad is based on opinion.
More people say bad than they good. Thus it IS as bad as they say, you can't argue with majority.

False, false, false. Sorry [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/whistling.png[/smilie]

I myself am something of a whiner so I believe the people who say it's bad (I haven't played it, but hey, I'm a pessimist), but to say that you can't argue with majority... well let's just say you're lucky you haven't yet realised how stupid the majority of people can be [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/uncertain.png[/smilie]

Modifié par Obtusifolius, 27 mars 2010 - 03:07 .

[Yrkoon]

  Damn, Xionraserai, I was with you up until you said this: 

Xionraserai wrote...


in other words if you dont have something good to say you shouldnt say anything at all, that just as a hint for cultured conversation

What a load of BS.

The gaming industry lives and dies by fans speaking their minds, and  saying BAD things when when a company  deserves it.

Why do you think  there's no SecuROM  on your copy of Dragon Age?  Is it because  of  gamers like you  who  decided  to stay silent on the issue?  Or is it because  of gamers like me who  raised  a stink so loud that  even   the Judges and Lawyers took notice?

Modifié par Yrkoon, 27 mars 2010 - 03:07 .

[Phonantiphon]

I think that *so far* it's very good.

It is what it is - an expansion pack - and it's fine as that.

There were problems with bug in the original game and patches, and there are problems with bugs here. Detracts from the enjoyment of the gameplay fair enough, but that said - as an expansion pack it's very good.

It's down to people's expectations.

[Obtusifolius]

bassmunkee wrote...

I think that *so far* it's very good.
It is what it is - an expansion pack - and it's fine as that.
There were problems with bug in the original game and patches, and there are problems with bugs here. Detracts from the enjoyment of the gameplay fair enough, but that said - as an expansion pack it's very good.
It's down to people's expectations.

So as long as you expected it to be crap, you ain't gonna be disappointed?

[Varyen]

don't get me wrong, the over all game was fine & I liked it. But I join in with the large group of players who wern't happy with it. I didn't have a whole lot of bugs, mainly the DLC stuff, a graphics coding on the sentinal armor & the sword but my biggest issue with the game was there was no "closure" at the end. You kill the mother & it's over, I wanted to return to the keep or the city, something simlier to the orgins ending in a manor of speaking. Sorry, not worth $40.00, $25.00 is about what I think it's worth . I'm not hating but...

[biomag]

Well this whole expansion wasn't a failure, but it was a weak product for BioWare.

It had all things that were needed to be a great addition, but at the same time BioWare just didn't finish each idea. Like many reviews said, upgrading the keep was a nice thing, but very short and baddly done. They should have made it like at Neverwinter Nights 2. There should be more effect on what your guards are doing than a short epilog. Recruitment and training should had been part of the upgrades, was well as weapon and armor smithing more than just finding 3 items somewhere. You should have been able to  use the army like at Neverwinter Nights 2 for guarding the streets, recruiting, training, and so on... Also is there a reason why you shouldn't send your soldiers to retrieve those granit stones for the wall? There are no disadvantages in doing so.
So upgrading & managing the keep was simply weak and looked not finished.

Bugs... well, I couldn't believe it. Item sets not spawing, while others could be partially bought twice as Herren's shop replentished itself with the same stock when the walls been repaired? While talking to the "father" there was a black screen after one of my companions spoke... and so on, and so on... the whole game looked rushed and not taken seriously by the devs.

The story was fine, also the lenght was ok. Only the ending was... well, who played it will know it.

Difficulty was even easy on nightmare.


All together I wouldn't recommand this expansion to anyone but people who really liked DAO and simply need more, while the standart/level of the product doesn't matter. If BioWare would have taken more time to finish the game properly it would have been a pretty good product.

[Xionraserai]

Yrkoon wrote...

  Damn, Xionraserai, I was with you up until you said this: 

Xionraserai wrote...


in other words if you dont have something good to say you shouldnt say anything at all, that just as a hint for cultured conversation

What a load of BS.

The gaming industry lives and dies by fans speaking their minds, and  saying BAD things when when a company  deserves it.

Why do you think  there's no SecuROM  on your copy of Dragon Age?  Is it because  of  gamers like you  who  decided  to stay silent on the issue?  Or is it because  of gamers like me who  raised  a stink so loud that  even   the Judges and Lawyers took notice?

that wasnt specifically towards you personally, i said that in general
if i werent a game producing company i would rather listen to ppl that tell my criticism in a serious and cultured way like "hey man that part of the game wasnt good it would have been better if it were like that" then listening to insulting crap like "your game is ****" ... << i cant work with such a sentence, game is **** ok what to change?

maybe its just me but im a very diplomatic person, nothing happens if you yell at ppl and insult them
a serious, cultured and honest conversation is way better and ppl can actually work things out way better, atleast thats my philosophy

[Realmzmaster]

The problem is anytime someone begins their critique of a product with the words, "Your product is crap!, the person on the receiving end will get defensive and start to tune out anything you say after that. It is not a productive statement. It may allow you to vent your frustrations, but that is about all.

If you say " I did not like your product because. You then state the reasons for your displeasure. This act makes for a constructive discussion.
Calling people whiners, haters and fanboys is not constructive. Insulting Bioware's DA development team will not get you anywhere either. Why? Because they are human just like the rest of us. If you approach them in a respectful manner they will listen.
They may not like what you have to say, but at least you will have their ear. Come at them or any human first with an insult and they may turn a deaf ear to what you have to say after the insult. No matter how valid the points.
Hurl an insult at a person's work without anything to back it up is a sure way to get ignored. The squeaky wheel only gets the oil if it can validate its point. Otherwise it get ignored.
People have legitimate points about bugs. They have legitimate points about design decisions. On the other end people who have had no problems have just as much right to state that as the people who had problems.
People who liked or loved the expansion and state their reasons are just as valid. Opinions vary. That is why they are called opinions.
If you think you have found a bug or bugs in DA:O or DA:A then report it in the technical forum. Make sure that the fault does not lie with your system first. Have you updated your drivers? Do you have other software that conflicts with the game? Have you modded your game? What are your computer specifications?
If you have a piece of software on your machine that conflicts with the game, BioWare cannot solve that issue. Bugs inherent in the game are Bioware's responsibility. Making sure it runs on the OSes stated are their responsibility.
You keeping your system up to date is your responsibility. Complaining to BioWare about a video problem bug and you have not updated your driver in two years may be your fault.(No, I am not saying people do not keep their systems updated. Well some do some don't. It is an example.)
The basic point is to be civil and respect each other opinions, but back up your opinion with constructive thought.

Modifié par Realmzmaster, 27 mars 2010 - 07:13 .

[Xionraserai]

bamm!

what realmsmaster wrote is EXACTLY what i mean to say, tho he choosed better words to explain

actually theres nothing more to add to that

thanks realmsmaster ^^

[Domyk]

Xionraserai wrote...

first i was very dissapointed about the whole RTO thing for ps3 and i read alot in the forums about awakening before and while i played it

many ppl complain about bugs and the entire addon but i really have to say i dont understand them

i just finished awakening and it isnt at all that bad like everyone is yelling
i found one major bug at the beginning which you can avoid easily, but the rest of the game just ran ok if you oversee some minor graphik bugs and the fact that i couldnt find all pieces of 2 armor sets (one was the mage one "wisdom" something else, and the black rogue one but meh im warrior with my main so hirols blah was good enouth and thats some really nice piece in look and stats)

so where was i? ah right .. the story is a little big thin but all in all its a great addition and imo worth its money, gave me fun for atleast 20 hours

the only thing i was sad was thats its over already, it has a really great potential and i wished the story were deeper and i would have had more time, way more time to "learn to know?" the companions like velanna and anders better

the companions have also a great deal of potential which imo was a little bit wasted in a small add on but shows the quality bioware produces

in total and to cut short i really like awakenings its a great addition to the game with much fun and really nice and beautiful areas especially kal hirol looks really nice

so despite all "haters" keep your work bioware, RTO was a "bad happening" but you excused it a big bunch with awakenings

hope to get a new DLC or addon soon ^^ thanks and happy programming guys!!

top issue most have with awakening is the continuity.  The key major decisions your toon made in origins carry over little to the expansion.  For those that just want new npcs to kill along with new artwork will enjoy it for the most part.

[TJSolo]

Realmzmaster wrote...

The problem is anytime someone begins their critique of a product with the words, "Your product is crap!, the person on the receiving end will get defensive and start to tune out anything you say after that. It is not a productive statement. It may allow you to vent your frustrations, but that is about all.

Except the fact the people taking exception to the "Your product is crap!" line is not the person on the receiving end. This is how people talk when they are not paid or contractually obligated to talk properly. The people on the receiving end seem to be more thickskinned then the non-intended audience of lines like "Your product is crap!".
Some people just are not able to articulate better then that.
No matter how counterproductive a person thinks a line like "Your product is crap!" is, it seems that those threads are the most active.